You do not understand AT ALL, Mage. The number of unique addresses where coins were shuffled in and out of is ridiculous, and growing by the second- it is still going on full force as this is typed. Now you have to include a supposed theft of not only millions of coins, but also Prime Controllers which shit out thousands of coins a day. Which coins are you going to brand as legitimate? And who EXACTLY gets to decide? Josh? The people hand picked by Josh to distance Paycoin from him, as per plan? The "theives" who stole coins and Prime Controllers? What if Josh is tried and found innocent of all charges? THEN what? Are YOU going to pay the fucker back when he sues???  The things you have been suggesting as far as fixing Paycoin are completely fucking absurd and show no aforethought whatsoever. My suggestion is to either spell out an exact plan for your "fix" of Paycoin or never mention it again.

Yay, only 10 pages behind.

I think identifying and removing Prime Controllers and their coins is technically doable. Beyond that - you're right, it gets murky.

Note I said "technically". There would be serious issues, like how to make the current PC owners to give them up voluntarily or make the change "secretly" so that they don't dump before it's forked.

The primary issue I see is theft and respecting property rights. Homero created this coin and put the vast majority of them in his pocket. Fact. He owns them, done deal, it's over. Not saying I think it is a good thing or that I support Homero or his scheme in any way, shape, or form (obviously), but what we are talking about here is taking someone's property. Just because some people decide they don't like him does NOT give them the right to take his property. Example: If I were to start a Real Estate investment group with 100 shares, and held 49 shares and a group of investors held the other 51, it does NOT give them the right to hold a majority shareholder meeting and eliminate my shares to increase the value of their shares, regardless of what they think of me. That would simply not be legal. Do you think Mage would think it is a good idea to pull some monkeyshit like that with Litecoin? It would boost the value of the remaining coins- RIGHT? Pure genius. Why not do it? Get at least 51% of Litecoin holders together and eliminate the coins of whomever does not support them, or does not get the memo in time to get "validated" or those that wish to remain anonymous. Poof, Litecoin gets a huge price per coin boost.

So you are saying that Josh should keep his Coins? What about if a person received the Coins through illegitimate means? Does that mean that the person should keep the Coins, especially if they have near infinite selling power with them?

You statement about litecoin doing is false, because if you were just doing it where you would cut off a certain part of the Coins that don't agree with your views then that part would fight against it and sell their Coins and attack the value so you wouldn't be gaining any value by doing it.

Who decides what is "illegitimate means"? You? Me? Josh? Mage? TeamXPY? What Mage has been suggesting about seizing and burning coins is theft. FUCK Josh, this is not about him. If some group of people are allowed to to what they please with a crypto currency because they don't like someone the whole system is fucked- completely. The fact is that Homero created Paycoin and put most of them in his pocket. That makes them legitimate- regardless of what you think of the scamming prick. If you don't like it then don't buy any. Not liking how someone else decided to make a coin does not suddenly make it right to steal what is not yours. Josh owns them fucking coins, and stealing his coins will do a billion times more damage to the core principles of crypto than that scamming turd ever could no matter how many idiots he cons into buying them. If it is allowed to be done to one person (regardless of what you or I think of him- and trust me, I think Josh is a fucking turd) then crypto is not secure for anyone.

Absolutely, Josh should not keep his coins... but destroying a technology for the purpose of getting back at an individual is NOT the way to do it. Cryptocurrency is just that, a cryptocurrency. No one wants to program dollar bills to scream and run away from drug dealers... the enforcement of laws or morals is left up to agencies and/or the public through public opinion... moral judgements is absolutely not the proper place to apply technology of any kind. If you want Josh's coins to be worthless, then make sure no one will trade or do business with him. Let the agencies confiscate them against his debts, fines, and fees.  But, for all that is reasonable... do not even introduce the idea of trashing a technology by overlaying arbitrary moral judgements onto it.

I don't think a decision of "legitimacy" is really needed. Seizing and burning are "old school" concepts, luckily in crypto it's relatively easy to create "parallel universes" so to speak. The coin would be forked, just like any coin can be forked for any reason. If someone (let's say PC owners) decide to follow the fork that keeps the PCs and their coins and their stake rates - that's fine. Those who follow the fork without PCs would have a separate ecosystem, and technically we could even have both forks listed on exchanges. Then the market could decide how much the coin is worth with or without PCs. Homero could still dump his coins, I'm sure there would always be some rinky-dink exchange willing to make a few satoshis on fees.

That's the idealistic scenario of course. The reality would be much more messy, it always is whenever Mr. Brilliant is involved. And I think there is a real chance we could see such hostile fork(s) emerging, seeing how things are going at the moment.

I see some apples and oranges mixups going on with the discussion about proposals to seize Josh's Paycoins. The bit where Josh posted the hardly intelligible rambling about stealing tv's had to do with the coins he said were stolen from him. What Mage is suggesting be done is to seize Paycoins that were created as part of Paycoin and have been Josh's property ever since. You either respect property rights or you don't. Whatever you think of Josh personally he owns millions of Paycoins- he did not steal them. If people are stupid enough to buy into a crypto coin where one guy owns damned near all of them that is their choice. Josh dumping the coins into markets is also probably not actually illegal- it is just a breach of trust on his part because he said he would not do that. Unethical and underhanded, but probably not actually illegal. What exactly would be the "charge" laid against Josh to justify seizing his coins and destroying them? If I were him and it happened to me I would sue, seriously. There are lots of crimes involved in this whole fraud scheme, but Josh creating millions of Paycoins and putting them in his own wallet is not one of them. Then, on top of that, if there really were such a seize&burn action against Josh- how does anybody know if he was not actually the one behind it? Letting a few million Paycoins get burned would make him look like a victim, AND perhaps remove some of the shit stain of Josh from Paycoin- but who knows how many coins he protected from being seized? Letting a shitload of XPY get burned so that the other millions he has hidden are worth way more would be a HUGE fucking win for Josh. The plan to seize and burn Josh's coins is so ill thought out and illogical there are giant holes in it wherever you look. If you want to get back at Josh, let Paycoin dive into the Satoshi price level. Don't salvage the fucking coin for him for fuck's sake- cmon- you think he doesn't want that?