Holy shit. There's actually enough information here to open an investigation on Inaba. The quote tags were edited, and the screenshot appears fake. I think QuestionAuthority might be right:
Hahaha... post with the wrong sock puppet account there, sport? Epic!
*EDIT* - For those of you who may have missed it, Garr just accidentally posted with his Werner account and then deleted the post and reposted with Garr when he realized he screwed up.
I was refreshing this thread every 30 seconds to not miss any of this juicy garbage and I didn't see that. I think you're smoking something.
Quote from: Inaba on Today at 02:58:55
Quote
I did not request a refund. If you refund me, I expect the full amount of BTC I paid to be refunded. If you are able to do this I will gladly take my business elsewhere, because believe it or not you have competition now
You'll get the full amount you paid in USD, since that's how our products are priced.
As a point of fact, you did request a refund, let me quote you:
Quote
but your business operations and ethic are both unacceptable.
You find them unacceptable, I understand. We will cut ties and move on and you no longer have to deal with the unacceptable (to you) business nature. We do not want to force you into a position where you are must deal with an unacceptable situation, so we are removing that roadblock from your happiness. I'm done here, your refund will be processed by COB tomorrow.
I think you're misunderstanding my logic. Take Apple Computer for example. A company that produces an admittedly good product, but not in the most ethical way. I am open about how they shouldn't employ FoxConn for their assembly etc, but they do it anyway, and I live with it.
My intentions are not to anger anyone, or disrupt my business relationship with BFL. I just want to promote honesty, and discourage the opposite.
Give me truth and I'll give you peace. Most people think that's simple enough.
Quote
I did not request a refund. If you refund me, I expect the full amount of BTC I paid to be refunded. If you are able to do this I will gladly take my business elsewhere, because believe it or not you have competition now
You'll get the full amount you paid in USD, since that's how our products are priced.
As a point of fact, you did request a refund, let me quote you:
Quote
but your business operations and ethic are both unacceptable.
You find them unacceptable, I understand. We will cut ties and move on and you no longer have to deal with the unacceptable (to you) business nature. We do not want to force you into a position where you are must deal with an unacceptable situation, so we are removing that roadblock from your happiness. I'm done here, your refund will be processed by COB tomorrow.
I think you're misunderstanding my logic. Take Apple Computer for example. A company that produces an admittedly good product, but not in the most ethical way. I am open about how they shouldn't employ FoxConn for their assembly etc, but they do it anyway, and I live with it.
My intentions are not to anger anyone, or disrupt my business relationship with BFL. I just want to promote honesty, and discourage the opposite.
Give me truth and I'll give you peace. Most people think that's simple enough.
Hahaha... post with the wrong sock puppet account there, sport? Epic!
*EDIT* - For those of you who may have missed it, Garr just accidentally posted with his Werner account and then deleted the post and reposted with Garr when he realized he screwed up.
I was refreshing this thread every 30 seconds to not miss any of this juicy garbage and I didn't see that. I think you're smoking something.
Yes, by all means, open an investigation. Lets see the IP logs of the posts and the post history. SMF does have soft delete, right? I use it on vBulletin all the time, any posts that are deleted are removed from public view, but I can view and recover them when I need to.
I still have the thread open in my browser as well, looking at it right now as a matter of fact. In fact, lets post Garr's Skype log to me:
Quote
[6/19/2013 3:15:00 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Hi josh.zerlan, I'd like to add you as a contact. Garrett Ian MacDonald
[6/19/2013 3:25:13 AM] Josh Zerlan: What can I help you with?
[6/19/2013 3:25:17 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Thanks for adding me
[6/19/2013 3:25:21 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: free for a call?
[6/19/2013 3:25:30 AM] Josh Zerlan: No, it's too late at night for that.
[6/19/2013 3:25:54 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I was wondering what your policy is on canceling orders, sir.
[6/19/2013 3:26:04 AM] Josh Zerlan: With regards to what?
[6/19/2013 3:28:17 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Dude this is Garr. I have to shamefully apologize for calling your company out, and making you think I don't want to deal with you, because most of my orders are not for me and have been sold to other people already.
[6/19/2013 3:29:07 AM] Josh Zerlan: You know, that might have carried some weight before you used a sock puppet account to troll me, then used your own account to lie about it and AGAIN essentially call me a liar.
[6/19/2013 3:29:21 AM] Josh Zerlan: You and I both know Werner is your sock puppet account
[6/19/2013 3:29:28 AM] Josh Zerlan: Given the speed you did your editing, I suspect you posted from the same IP
[6/19/2013 3:29:52 AM] Josh Zerlan: So getting a mod to check the IPs on those two posts will probably yield up the proof required to call you out on that
[6/19/2013 3:30:04 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I'm just saying, it will hurt other customers more than me if you terminate our relationship. The terms I've agreed to with them exempt me from you canceling my order without a formal request.
[6/19/2013 3:30:34 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: It will hurt me a lot as well, still
[6/19/2013 3:30:36 AM] Josh Zerlan: Right... so you think it's ok to abuse me and BFL at your liesure and I should just bend over and take it? It doesn't work like that here.
[6/19/2013 3:31:10 AM] Josh Zerlan: You did make a formal request. You explicitly stated that our business ethics etc... were unacceptable.
[6/19/2013 3:31:15 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Well in my defense, can you argue against my accusations? This is not the outcome I intended.
[6/19/2013 3:32:00 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Are you a believer in implied word, or actual word. Because I am actually asking you to not cancel my orders, please.
[6/19/2013 3:33:46 AM] Josh Zerlan: Yes, I can easily arguing against your accusations. I already did. There are orders ahead of you in the queue that were in before Bitpay. Most notably some FPGA orders that were never delivered at the customer request and converted into ASIC orders. There's not a lot of them, but there's some of them.
[6/19/2013 3:34:16 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Okay, that does make sense
[6/19/2013 3:34:46 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: now that you tell me straight up and not through (what I suspect to be) a puppet.
[6/19/2013 3:34:58 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: ^sorry if I'm wrong about that
[6/19/2013 3:35:06 AM] Josh Zerlan: Unlike you, Garrett, I have but one account (or two if you cound BFL_Josh).
[6/19/2013 3:35:15 AM] Josh Zerlan: I'm not duplicious or dishonest like you appear to be at this point.
[6/19/2013 3:35:17 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: a smart person would use a VPN with a sock puppet account.
[6/19/2013 3:36:04 AM] Josh Zerlan: Yes, you could have been using a VPN with your puppet, but given the speed you switched it up, unless your VPN was on another computer, I doubt you had time to switch off your VPN and back on.
[6/19/2013 3:36:05 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Honestly I just want you to be forthcoming with your business operations
[6/19/2013 3:36:18 AM] Josh Zerlan: Dude, your credibility is shot after the stunt with Werner.
[6/19/2013 3:36:28 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I don't want to discuss that.
[6/19/2013 3:36:38 AM] Josh Zerlan: Are you honestly sitting there trying to lecture me on being forthcoming after that?
[6/19/2013 3:36:57 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I'm not bothering arguing that.
[6/19/2013 3:37:21 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Really I wish we weren't here having this discussion
[6/19/2013 3:38:12 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: You have to admit, that being an outsider of BFL, and seeing people be sent units with the explicit agreement that they would post picutres, that it looks shady.
[6/19/2013 3:38:25 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I just want to get the truth.
[6/19/2013 3:38:59 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: And with your explaination for the FPGA orders, I believe I have it. At least part of it.
[6/19/2013 3:39:07 AM] Josh Zerlan: There's been several singles sent out, there's only one picture that I know of, and that's Allten. We are shipping out in order. I know it's hard to believe, but the majority of our orders don't come from Bitcointalk members.
[6/19/2013 3:39:21 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: It's totally believable
[6/19/2013 3:39:38 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: just something that most don't take into account as often as we should
[6/19/2013 3:39:42 AM] Josh Zerlan: Bitcointalk forum members are a signifigant faction, yes, but they are by no means a majority.
[6/19/2013 3:40:05 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Yep that is analogous with cognitive shareholders
[6/19/2013 3:40:18 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: so I understand that.
[6/19/2013 3:40:29 AM] Josh Zerlan: So, if you want to clean the slate, fine. You need to apologize publically for calling me and BFL liars, admit Werner is your sock puppet account and apologize for utilizing it to troll me.
[6/19/2013 3:40:44 AM] Josh Zerlan: Then we can just forget it happened and move on.
[6/19/2013 3:46:01 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Okay, writing a post now...
[6/19/2013 4:02:56 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Done. I genuinely appreciate your giving me the opportunity to keep my orders.
[6/19/2013 4:05:58 AM] Josh Zerlan: That is probably one of the most disingenuous apologies I have ever seen, I have to admit.
[6/19/2013 4:07:09 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: It wasn't intended to be anything more than you asked.
[6/19/2013 4:07:20 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Again, sorry for making you and I both look like cunts.
[6/19/2013 4:07:22 AM] Josh Zerlan: Clearly
[6/19/2013 3:25:13 AM] Josh Zerlan: What can I help you with?
[6/19/2013 3:25:17 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Thanks for adding me
[6/19/2013 3:25:21 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: free for a call?
[6/19/2013 3:25:30 AM] Josh Zerlan: No, it's too late at night for that.
[6/19/2013 3:25:54 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I was wondering what your policy is on canceling orders, sir.
[6/19/2013 3:26:04 AM] Josh Zerlan: With regards to what?
[6/19/2013 3:28:17 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Dude this is Garr. I have to shamefully apologize for calling your company out, and making you think I don't want to deal with you, because most of my orders are not for me and have been sold to other people already.
[6/19/2013 3:29:07 AM] Josh Zerlan: You know, that might have carried some weight before you used a sock puppet account to troll me, then used your own account to lie about it and AGAIN essentially call me a liar.
[6/19/2013 3:29:21 AM] Josh Zerlan: You and I both know Werner is your sock puppet account
[6/19/2013 3:29:28 AM] Josh Zerlan: Given the speed you did your editing, I suspect you posted from the same IP
[6/19/2013 3:29:52 AM] Josh Zerlan: So getting a mod to check the IPs on those two posts will probably yield up the proof required to call you out on that
[6/19/2013 3:30:04 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I'm just saying, it will hurt other customers more than me if you terminate our relationship. The terms I've agreed to with them exempt me from you canceling my order without a formal request.
[6/19/2013 3:30:34 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: It will hurt me a lot as well, still
[6/19/2013 3:30:36 AM] Josh Zerlan: Right... so you think it's ok to abuse me and BFL at your liesure and I should just bend over and take it? It doesn't work like that here.
[6/19/2013 3:31:10 AM] Josh Zerlan: You did make a formal request. You explicitly stated that our business ethics etc... were unacceptable.
[6/19/2013 3:31:15 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Well in my defense, can you argue against my accusations? This is not the outcome I intended.
[6/19/2013 3:32:00 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Are you a believer in implied word, or actual word. Because I am actually asking you to not cancel my orders, please.
[6/19/2013 3:33:46 AM] Josh Zerlan: Yes, I can easily arguing against your accusations. I already did. There are orders ahead of you in the queue that were in before Bitpay. Most notably some FPGA orders that were never delivered at the customer request and converted into ASIC orders. There's not a lot of them, but there's some of them.
[6/19/2013 3:34:16 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Okay, that does make sense
[6/19/2013 3:34:46 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: now that you tell me straight up and not through (what I suspect to be) a puppet.
[6/19/2013 3:34:58 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: ^sorry if I'm wrong about that
[6/19/2013 3:35:06 AM] Josh Zerlan: Unlike you, Garrett, I have but one account (or two if you cound BFL_Josh).
[6/19/2013 3:35:15 AM] Josh Zerlan: I'm not duplicious or dishonest like you appear to be at this point.
[6/19/2013 3:35:17 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: a smart person would use a VPN with a sock puppet account.
[6/19/2013 3:36:04 AM] Josh Zerlan: Yes, you could have been using a VPN with your puppet, but given the speed you switched it up, unless your VPN was on another computer, I doubt you had time to switch off your VPN and back on.
[6/19/2013 3:36:05 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Honestly I just want you to be forthcoming with your business operations
[6/19/2013 3:36:18 AM] Josh Zerlan: Dude, your credibility is shot after the stunt with Werner.
[6/19/2013 3:36:28 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I don't want to discuss that.
[6/19/2013 3:36:38 AM] Josh Zerlan: Are you honestly sitting there trying to lecture me on being forthcoming after that?
[6/19/2013 3:36:57 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I'm not bothering arguing that.
[6/19/2013 3:37:21 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Really I wish we weren't here having this discussion
[6/19/2013 3:38:12 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: You have to admit, that being an outsider of BFL, and seeing people be sent units with the explicit agreement that they would post picutres, that it looks shady.
[6/19/2013 3:38:25 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: I just want to get the truth.
[6/19/2013 3:38:59 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: And with your explaination for the FPGA orders, I believe I have it. At least part of it.
[6/19/2013 3:39:07 AM] Josh Zerlan: There's been several singles sent out, there's only one picture that I know of, and that's Allten. We are shipping out in order. I know it's hard to believe, but the majority of our orders don't come from Bitcointalk members.
[6/19/2013 3:39:21 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: It's totally believable
[6/19/2013 3:39:38 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: just something that most don't take into account as often as we should
[6/19/2013 3:39:42 AM] Josh Zerlan: Bitcointalk forum members are a signifigant faction, yes, but they are by no means a majority.
[6/19/2013 3:40:05 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Yep that is analogous with cognitive shareholders
[6/19/2013 3:40:18 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: so I understand that.
[6/19/2013 3:40:29 AM] Josh Zerlan: So, if you want to clean the slate, fine. You need to apologize publically for calling me and BFL liars, admit Werner is your sock puppet account and apologize for utilizing it to troll me.
[6/19/2013 3:40:44 AM] Josh Zerlan: Then we can just forget it happened and move on.
[6/19/2013 3:46:01 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Okay, writing a post now...
[6/19/2013 4:02:56 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Done. I genuinely appreciate your giving me the opportunity to keep my orders.
[6/19/2013 4:05:58 AM] Josh Zerlan: That is probably one of the most disingenuous apologies I have ever seen, I have to admit.
[6/19/2013 4:07:09 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: It wasn't intended to be anything more than you asked.
[6/19/2013 4:07:20 AM] Garrett Ian MacDonald: Again, sorry for making you and I both look like cunts.
[6/19/2013 4:07:22 AM] Josh Zerlan: Clearly