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Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
by
psycodad
on 28/08/2020, 07:28:09 UTC
⭐ Merited by vapourminer (3) ,JayJuanGee (1) ,Dabs (1) ,AlcoHoDL (1)
"I can state flatly that heavier than air flying machines are impossible."

— Lord Kelvin, 1895

No source?

Source: New Scientist — 10 Impossibilities Conquered by Science


"Brute force attacks against 256-bit keys will be infeasible until computers are built from something other than matter and occupy something other than space".

-Bruce Schneier

"I can state flatly that heavier than air flying machines are impossible."

— Lord Kelvin, 1895

Brute force, so checking every combination, makes some pretty easily verifiable claims.

If you build a supercomputer that occupies a space of only 1 cubic centimetre, that can brute force 1 trillion keys a second, and cover the entire earths surface with these computers, the Sun will swallow the Earth, before you have time to search the whole 256 bit key space.

I have also seen other calculations that information represented as its absolute minimum energy in the laws of physics, that there is not enough energy in the Sun to search a 256 bit key space either.

These numbers have nothing to do with the technology of the devices; they are the maximums that thermodynamics will allow. So these Laws of Thermodynamics will have to be broken first.

I would very much like to see the proof regarding the necessity of the Laws of Thermodynamics to be broken in order to brute force a 256-bit key. Is there any link of such proof? I'm a bit concerned about the use of energy to do the calculations.



Applied Cryptography (1996) by Bruce Schneier page 157 (I am looking at my 2nd edition here):

One of the consequences of the second law of thermodynamics is that a certain amount of energy is necessary to represent information. To record a single bit by changing the state of a system requires an amount of energy no less than kT, where T is the absolute temperature of the system and k is the Boltzman constant. (Stick with me; the physics lesson is almost over.)

Given that k = 1.38×10-16 erg/°Kelvin, and that the ambient temperature of the universe is 3.2°Kelvin, an ideal computer running at 3.2°K would consume 4.4×10-16 ergs every time it set or cleared a bit. To run a computer any colder than the cosmic background radiation would require extra energy to run a heat pump.

Now, the annual energy output of our sun is about 1.21×1041 ergs. This is enough to power about 2.7×1056 single bit changes on our ideal computer; enough state changes to put a 187-bit counter through all its values. If we built a Dyson sphere around the sun and captured all its energy for 32 years, without any loss, we could power a computer to count up to 2192. Of course, it wouldn't have the energy left over to perform any useful calculations with this counter.

But that's just one star, and a measly one at that. A typical supernova releases something like 1051 ergs. (About a hundred times as much energy would be released in the form of neutrinos, but let them go for now.) If all of this energy could be channeled into a single orgy of computation, a 219-bit counter could be cycled through all of its states.

These numbers have nothing to do with the technology of the devices; they are the maximums that thermodynamics will allow. And they strongly imply that brute-force attacks against 256-bit keys will be infeasible until computers are built from something other than matter and occupy something other than space.

He does quote this paragraph quite often, for example here: https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2009/09/the_doghouse_cr.html