retired options (meaning remaining retired) is not to go back to work, as obviously you are not retired if you are working
Obviously, you lack nuance in your proclamations.
retired options are to: stay home, or do chores, hobbies, or go travelling, socialising and other life stuff.. not involving work*
*work: obligated labour in exchange for income
*work: obligated labour in exchange for income
Maybe I can give some example? not that it is going to change the mind of a dogmatist like you, Franky1, but here goes.
I am in the process of minding my own business, and perhaps consuming a few hookers, lambos and blow, and go out on a day trip (such as a picnic and a hike into the hills and then a swim at the beach), and so on the way back to one of my yachts, I decide to stop by the steak and lobster place to grab a bite and maybe warm up the atmosphere for a later midnight snack, and while I am in the steak house, I bump into one of my old friends from college (or high school), and I decide to invite him to have some steak and lobster and buy him a drink, since it has been a year or more since we had seen each other. In the process of our conversation, I find out that in the next couple of days he is going to be moving, and I also find out that he had been buying bitcoin, yet he was still confused about how to store his bitcoin, and he describes some of his BTC buying practices to me. Maybe I spend more than an hour talking with the guy as we are chowing down on our meal and enjoying our drinks, and after such conversation, I decide that I am going to want to spend some more time with the guy, so I offer to help him move, and I suggest to him that we should also get together within the month and go over various aspects of bitcoin, so I consider that such future meetings will be good for both of us.
A month later, it ends up being that I had spent a couple of days helping the guy move, and I even ended up helping him to paint one of his bedrooms, and I ended up calling one of my construction buddies so that the construction buddy could change two of his doors, add a shower door to one of his bathtubs and add a closet to one of his bedrooms. I also ended up meeting with him twice to go over various bitcoin related matters, which also involved my giving him assignments on the first meeting so that we would be able to go into more depth in our second meeting.
At the end of the month, after our 4th or 5th meeting, I suggested that we should stay in touch more, and my friend told me that he was really happy with how much he had benefitted from our meetings, and he said that he was not sure exactly how to pay me back, and I told him that I did not really care either way if he paid me back or not. He told me that he would think about how he was going to pay me back, and he would get back with me about that, and I repeated that it does not really matter to me, either way
About two weeks later, the guy contacted me, and he said that he wanted to meet for lunch sometime, and so we arranged a lunch, and at the lunch he gave me $2k in cash, $5k in bitcoin (after I showed him a bitcoin receiving address) and 7-day cruise tickets for two persons (with open dates to be used within a year to a destination that we had previously discussed to be of an interesting potential for me) that were valued around $5k. I told him that he did not need to buy me anything, and he said that he really valued my help in those matters, and he thinks that he had gotten more value from our exchange rather than the value that I had gotten, and so he wanted to compensate me for the value that he perceived himself to have had been getting.
none of this sounds like obligated employment
none of this sounds like work
it sounds like favours and chores and showing appreciation
it seems you lack even knowledge of what WORK is.. vs doing a friend a favour and them repaying you some how
heck you even call your 'help' and helping a friend..
you didnt mention client, employer, customer
so its obvious that your example is not a form of obligated work for a contracted salary/income
He told me about our mutual friend who also could use similar kind of help, and he suggested that in the coming months that we meet up with our mutual friend to help him in similar kinds of ways, which implied that the compensation would be similar. I told him that I would get back with him about my thoughts on the matter of the mutual friend, about whether I wanted to do it, and if so how it might fit into my schedule. He said o.k., and about two weeks later, I got back with him and proposed a schedule in which I largely accepted our planned future project, and with a kind of implication that either he or our friend would probably end up insisting on paying me some kind of a similar amount.
again no obligation, no contract, no wording of customer, client, employer.. instead its all about helping a friend none of this sounds like obligated employment
you keep asserting that going back to work or continuing to work is somehow retiring/being retired, when you keep insanely determining that people can be in work whilst in FIRE status
Sure. That is more or less correct in regards to what I am asserting.
the FI is important if you want full financial independence(FI) to make ANY choice INCLUDING returning to or continuing work.. but adding the RE means you chose to retire and do life stuff instead, not work stuff
It seems quite likely that you go wrong in your trying to determine what is "work" versus "life" stuff, and surely I could concede that there could be some people who deceive themselves in regards to their own self-descriptions in regards to their level of financial independence and how it might apply to their abilities to say fuck you regarding any work relation that they might enter, which implies that sometimes the voluntariness of the involvement of any supposed financially independent person in any such work that he agrees to perform could be more compromised than such persons are willing to admit.
Perhaps you and I differ in how much weight or how much we want to get into details in regards to figuring out the extent to which the activities of purportedly financially independent persons are voluntary or not, and it seems that I hardly give too many shits about those kinds of details, and you want to jump in and proclaim those kinds of details as if they are deal breakers and/or that they eliminate certain persons from self-proclaiming as being in fuck you status or FIRE status or filthy rich status or whatever merely because they are not jumping through appropriate Frank1 definitional hoops.
i dont care if you personally want to work after you reach FI (your F U status) but dont describe yourself as retired whilst still affirming that you are working, it makes no sense
You also make little sense, so there is that angle, too.
though from time to time, to the extent that you are not bordering on annoying, you do provide some humor in your ongoing insistences upon your own definitional and quasi-psychotic frameworks.
as for your last paragraph, you could have just said you dont want to be part of(what you call) a 'dumb acronym' of FIRE. and instead you just want to reach the FI status and continue to have the philosophy to work if you want to
there is no problem and i have no problem with you just wanting to be FI
[/quote]there is no problem and i have no problem with you just wanting to be FI
im going to give u at this point at reading your endless walls of text of gibberish of you thinking the retirement is not retirement and how its actually still work
may you enjoy your life of endlessly being committed to work until the day of our death..
may you enjoy never experiencing FIRE
the stupid thing is if you really think that fire is as you deceive yourself to believe it is. then in your technical view you are already in FIRE... BUT reality of common sense shows that you are not and you just do not understand much about what work is and what retirement is to know the difference
i do hope you change your mindset and one day reach a target goal to actually enter fire (common sense definition).. but until then.. continue confusing yourself
you had your chance to learn and be educated by someone thats actually living the real FIRE lifestyle.. but instead your ego has pushed yourself into your self belief of your delusions and not allowed yourself open to earning things.... yet again
you have no idea what FIRE is all about and it seems you have no intention to learn and no intention to actually bee part of FIRE.. so just give up on the topic you know nothing about and dont want to know anything and dont want to ever be part of
but i do wish one day you do put your ego aside and learn the possibilities of a better life in the future and one day want to aim for it. instead of the actions you play around with right now