Thank you to all. Same block is what is needed, and indeed a larger fee seems to have worked in some cases I have seen.
Even with higher tx fee ordering will still be defined. There is nothing like exact same time inside a block, there is always a strict order recording for blocks in every Blockchain. The thing about validators is even with same tx fee and identical timestamps nodes will still put one transaction before the other. As far as miners are concerned there is no randomised order