Is this a serious reply? Did you re-read your post? It makes no sense. You're literally INVENTING arguments. How can meat be the inevitable decline of human health? How could you ever postulate that it's all because of meat. Do no other variables exist? Only smoking and drugs? Not genetics in any way?
There is no source or proof on this planet you could site that would prove this, ever. Because it doesn't exist.
The china study? Really? I've got that book on my book shelf and stopped reading after the first chapter. It's been debunked to death already multiple times on the internet.
Have you read the actual china study? The 1000+ page mammoth study? Because the study itself states that it's an OBSERVATIONAL study and isn't meant to be taken empirically.
Observation does not equal causation; the biggest mistake assumed by the china study followers.
My parents are great examples of this. My parents both eat meat and have been for over 65 years. My dad is still in great shape-- no belly; still skinny, no sickness or disease-- and still works as a landscaper and is still mentally sharp, my mom looks real good for her age, speaks two languages fluently blah blah blah... Both my parents hardly ever get sick and I don't think my mom has missed a day of work in over 8 years.
Your post is so moronic you don't see the irony in that your vegan lifestyle is your religion.
The arguments you're posting throughout this thread MIMIC the arguments I used to hear pro-christian people use.
In fact it has nothing to do specifically with religion; it's the mindset of the individual.
Your mindset-type is all over the spectrum: religion, politics, lifestyle.
The same way you said that meat-eaters are brainwashed could be said about vegans-- brainwashed.
I knew a chick from my work who was vegan for 3 years + and she was slow in the head, had mood swings and was always acting funny. Not to mention she actually admitted to not have had her period in the time she was vegan.
I kept telling her to have some meat and get some cholesterol in her diet to fix this problem. She eventually decided to give it a shot and started eating eggs, then liver and then chicken.
She said she felt great and she got her period again.
You want the truth coingeneral? The human body is adaptive. You just need to accept it. Humans can eat meat without any problem and, vice-versa, can do a vegan lifestyle (if done properly) as well as paleo or pescitairian etc...
Humans are omnivores and that lets us eat just about anything as long as it's prepared properly.
Why don't you go read Weston A. Prices' book on "Nutrition and Physical Degeneration".
Edit
For your time Coingeneral :
http://rawfoodsos.com/2010/07/07/the-china-study-fact-or-fallac/How can meat be the cause of decline in human health? First, read the entire China Study, it has not been debunked by Denise Minger, Dr. Campbell replied to her 'debunking'
here.
"Do I think the China Study findings constitute absolute scientific proof? Of course not. Does it provide enough information to inform some practical decision-making? Absolutely. An impressive and informative web of information was emerging from this study. But does every potential strand (or association) in this mammoth study fit perfectly into this web of information? No. Although most statistically significant strands readily fit into the web, there were a few surprises. Most, but not all, have since been explained." - Dr. T. Colin Campbell.
Second, you're claiming "observation does not equal causation" and I agree, yet you're recommending the book by Weston A. Price which is an ANECDOTAL study written in the 1930s by a dentist who looked at teeth health for overall vitality and you give observational examples of healthy meat eaters and unhealthy vegans yourself. Let me know how that isn't hypocritical.
You say you've read through a few pages of this thread, a chapter of the China Study, and you agree that 'humans are adaptive' and can live healthily without meat as a vegetarian and vegan. Plus don't forget about reversing cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc.
So do you not care about animals being slaughtered inhumanely, deforestation of the gorgeous Amazon rainforest for cattle ranching, fish extinction due to overfishing, etc? Or do you just want to be part of the population that helps destroy the planet?
All it takes for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing. Saving the planet starts with personal responsibility.
http://www.bu.edu/sustainability/files/2010/01/Meat-Consumption-Jpg.jpghttp://meetville.com/images/quotes/Quotation-Bob-Riley-good-evil-people-Meetville-Quotes-137502.jpgThat was the point of me posting about Weston A price's book. Although, in the book itself, he does perform some clinical trial studies with childrens' diets, but that's beside the point. I posted the book because it's exactly like you posting the china study.
Also Denise Minger to Campbell as well. It went back and forth a bit.
I like how you worked your way from health/lifestyle in to the ethics of being a vegan. Which is it's own topic, really.
You say you've read through a few pages of this thread, a chapter of the China Study, and you agree that 'humans are adaptive' and can live healthily without meat as a vegetarian and vegan. Plus don't forget about reversing cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc.
What was the point of that paragraph? It doesn't say anything pertaining to the discussion... You just want to infer that the vegan lifestyle is superior at any chance you get. My parents are in their 60's with no heart problems, or diabetes, or cancer.
Why not man? Shouldn't they just be about dead with all kinds of diseases that meat magically creates? Like bro, I thought for sure I would be able to find at least some sort of evidence of disease. What's up with that? What wizardly conclusion can you come up with to explain that?
I also didn't like the China Study by Campbell because he has an apparent agenda. He wasn't presenting the facts as is, he was presenting with intent to sway the read to non-meat lifestyle. It was so apparent from the beginning of the book.
Weston Price at least wrote his book like a journal and not so much with an agenda. It was just a record of his findings, that's all.
Ethics aside, because that's it's own debate, you've made no good points for veganism. Of the vegans I knew, they were very unhealthy and seemed cognitively slow, yet very adamant about their position on veganism.
You only managed to post some voodoo books about "cure your life problems with a vegan diet!" and "cure cancer with veganism! yeah! it's totally the best option out there", type bullshit.
I can start posting links to anthropological evidence that humans have been eating meat for thousands if not hundreds of thousands of years, if you want that. It's very clear and most modern scientist will say humans are omnivores.
