Post
Topic
Board Altcoin Discussion
Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer
by
aminorex
on 14/08/2014, 15:58:05 UTC
A fair bit of Anotheranonlol's screed was derisory to me personally, so I will respond out of a sense of obligation to represent, but I can't take time to respond to the entirety, so I will hit the highlights, starting with the headline complaint about XMR, then moving on to the bits directly pertinent to my public face:

Nobody is making a cult around zoidberg, Ask for an objective, outsider perspective on XMR and BBR; which one seems more more cult-like, which one seems more like a forced meme. XMR has multiple threads consistently pushed to the front page, fireside chats, monero missives, Random sprinklings of TA, big secret news that can't be spoken about yet, continual references that this is the silver to Bitcoins gold, that it is the ONLY alt worth investing in, subtle reminders that 'it won't stay cheap for long'.

* Multiple threads consistently pushed to the front page

There are a lot of people interested in monero, and they specialize threads topically because otherwise the traffic would be overwhelming and the amount of stuff you're not interested in would obscure the stuff you're interested in.
There seem to be a couple of ditto head sock puppets which occasionally show up, but for the most part you're just complaining about the large user community and organic growth -- bullish characteristics, not cultish ones.

* Fireside chats, monero missives

So developers communicate well.  How is this a negative?  Openness, coherent vision, strong community support.  It is irrational to deride these, unless your agenda is to attack.  I'm not saying your agenda is to attack.  I am saying that if it is not, then you are irrational, and to be marginalized, while if it is, then you are on team FUD, and to be marginalized.  Hopefully, this dilemma is false.  It is entirely up to you to find a third way.

* Random sprinklings of TA

Some people try to use technical analysis to find buy and sell points.  Most people are interested in what the future holds.  I can't see how this makes the community cult-like.

* big secret news that can't be spoken about yet

Are you projecting p&d coin marketing behaviour onto the XMR community, where it doesn't exist?  (Well it does exist, but only among very marginal characters, few in number.)  Occasionally events are planned in advance.  If you want to know more about them, instead of regarding that as a sinister plan, why not just ask the planners?

* continual references that this is the silver to Bitcoins gold

Like litecoin in the past.  I strongly disagree.  I consider XMR to be the uranium to bitcoin's coal, undiscovered value, which technological advance will one day differentiate.  

People who like XMR don't want to seem delusional to those who don't understand the compelling fundamental case for XMR, so they give it the lesser role, following the model of litecoin promoters in times past.  It's a rational strategy, not a cultish behaviour, although I disagree with it.

* it is the ONLY alt worth investing in

It is the only alt which has a leadership position in competition for what may be the largest market opportunity in history:  Primary provider of global, instant, private liquidity.  That does discriminate it from all other coins.  That doesn't mean that other crypto is not investable.  It does mean that by far the largest potential gains are in XMR.  

Refute my logic, please.  Don't use smears and emotional blackmail.  Facts and logic, please.  I will defend my position as long as I consider it tenable, and change it once I consider it refuted, and thank you for it.  But if you use fallacious or sophistical persuations, I will consider you an enemy of truth itself, at least until you repent.

* subtle reminders that 'it won't stay cheap for long'

This is a direct consequence of the previous point.

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I picked out a few quotes below.

As long as my credit is good, I am a buyer long past the point of despair.  When I start to feel the fear and depression, I cheer myself up by buying more.  I take some amphetamine and a shot of whiskey, if that's what it takes.  

Until people have obligations which can only be discharged in monero, there are no forced buyers, and volatility extremes will persist.  Just about the only thing that can give you a permanent loss is selling - especially forced sales from leverage.

Tell me what is irrational about my post, please?  I counsel against emotional investing.  I advocate an investment because I consider it beneficial.  I warn that it will be volatile.  I encourage discipline in holding to a long-term plan.  I counsel against excess leverage.  I do it in a colloquial style, with a dash of flourish, which may not be adapted to your humor, but these are sound, responsible positions.

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I just got a new convert.  A rates trader at Metlife took a few thousand from me as a tail hedge.  A miniscule position, but I suspect he will become a repeat customer and tell his friends.

I will be meeting with an fx option market maker later, and a hedge fund manager when we can work out a mutual time.  Also looking into contacts with a rather largish fixed income fund for meetups the next time I hit nyc.

..snip...

I might line up a presentation on monero at one or more btc nyc meetups or at the nyc bitcoin center.  Not by me, but by a friend who is better suited to the task.

In future I may line up some seminar groups in London, Hong Kong, and or Shanghai.

Oh and I will be having beers tomorrow after work with an SVP from Two Sigma.  XMR will not be neglected.

Like Mr. Blankfein, I feel I am doing God' s work.


I didn't see any BBR supporters talking like that just yet.


So BBR supporters are not pro-actively seeking to introduce BBR to the investment community, but I am seeking to introduce XMR to the investment community.  I don't see this as a problem for XMR, personally.  I am somewhat torn between the opposing considerations that lower prices now (which will probably be less volatile that would be higher prices at this early stage) aid in dispersion of the coin, and hence in the development of an organic economy, and the opposite consideration, that popularizing the investment potential will help focus capital formation in hands which are invested in XMR, and have an interest in seeing its economy grow.  I am technical more than entreprenurial, so I see more leverage in sparking capital formation for investment in the XMR economy than I do in anything I am likely to initiate myself, directly, at least for the time-being.  Hence I have chosen the latter.

Perhaps when BBR supporters start talking like that, on a sound basis, then BBR will exhibit more growth.  Frankly, I think that trying to convince a propdesk trader that his job will be safe if he buys more 'boolberries'  is a losing proposition.

The "god's work" comment has two subtexts:  

1) Derision of Mr. Blankfein's comment, and hence a self-deprecating humor, and

2) Allusion to the win-win characteristic of spreading XMR.

Now that DOES make it cult-like in one superficial way, but with many critical differences:  Proselytizing XMR is a rational ploy, open and honest, based on facts and logic, and materially beneficial to all parties.  The only material similarity to classic examples of cults is that it involves proselytization.  All decent and commedable capitalism should be win-win, unlike today's negative-sum crapcoin fest, red in tooth and claw.  Yes, I see XMR as "god's work" in that sense.  Also in the sense of "for this purpose was the son of God manifest:  to destroy the work of the evil one".  Scamcoins created to steal from the gullible are very much a satanic playground, in my view.  Do you disagree?

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Don't even think that's the worst of the bunch. Sure I heard someone saying they will ask their employer to get paid in XMR or quit.

Me again.  I haven't done it yet, but a little more FU money in the bank, and I may do it.  On the other hand, the permanent position is very appealling, and won't be paid in XMR under any circumstances, so it seems increasingly unlikely to happen.  It does appeal to my sense of whimsy.  It also appeals to my senses of personal integrity (to walk like I talk) and of self-interest (stacking XMR).

My reading of your rambling complaint is that you find facts, logic and humor to be offensive to your sensibilities.  I can't really object to that, but would warn you that retuning your sensibilities may be a desirable adaptation to reality, and a health-positive choice.