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Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
How low are we going to go on this dump?
275-270Gold and all other currencies are objectively shitty and deprectaed when compared to Bitcoin.
https://d262ilb51hltx0.cloudfront.net/max/800/1*8mimpqX08rd9eyToEgLQzg.png
https://d262ilb51hltx0.cloudfront.net/max/800/1*8mimpqX08rd9eyToEgLQzg.png
The chart misses the crucial point which is that gold is very widely and tightly held, so many people think of it as money, not so many see bitcoin that way. In addition, gold is the other big asset on central banks balance sheets in addition to foreign currencies, it will be used to recapitalise nations after the next crisis I think we all see coming.
Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
I think you hit the nail on the head, my sentiments exactly. There's no incentive or need for Joe public to use it right now and speculators arent interested anymore. And people talk about how we found a bottom at 166 well In terms of volume it was comparable to February 2014 when it hit 400 briefly, that didnt stop the continued slide down all year.
Re: What are you going to invest in now that the Bitcoin Fever is gone?
Some of you guys need to chill the fuck out, you've got one sad sadistic nutjob who spends most of his life on this website trying to wind people up, then these delusional guys who think bitcoin is going to replace fiat and make them millionaires. Take a break. Go outside, breathe in the fresh air
Re: What are you going to invest in now that the Bitcoin Fever is gone?
The thing about speculating in bitcoin now is that I dont know who the next round of speculators will be to pump the thing up. Where will they come from? Sure it could go to 400 from our bitcoiner group, but there's no willy bot and the Chinese seem to be done with it
Maybe it's time for it to embark down the long, hard road of becoming actually used by regular people. If it can pull that off then the future is bright.
One of the major Chinese exchanges back in the day estimated they had about 10,000 regular users. There is a teeny weeny bit of upside left.
It will get a bigger (niche) userbase I'm sure, but normal people have very little incentive to use Bitcoin. It has its currency niche but I think it has more of a chance at becoming some kind of esoteric store of value.
Anyway I dont want to hijack this thread, so to stick to the topic, some guy on here mentioned EXXI an oil stock a while back, I might put a bit of cash in that, if oil heads back up, that stock could go up 10X!
Re: What are you going to invest in now that the Bitcoin Fever is gone?
The thing about speculating in bitcoin now is that I dont know who the next round of speculators will be to pump the thing up. Where will they come from? Sure it could go to 400 from our bitcoiner group, but there's no willy bot and the Chinese seem to be done with it
Re: Counter to "Why Bitcoin is dropping ...buying." AMA format / doomsday debunked
As long as the rest of the world believes that our government can tax citizens and pay interest on its debt, the international community will have a demand for dollars. Demand for dollars is not only buying and selling of goods - most of the time it is transfer of US Treasurys, which act as cash equivalents. So if people think they will get paid back on their UST, they will have no problem dealing with the US and holding our debt. And this payments, we agree, will always be made.
And here is the problem. There are growing indications that the rest of the world does not think that, and other powerful countires (notably China) are trying to move away from the US dollar as a reserve currency. This is not unexpected - no currency has remained a reserve currency for much more than a century - and it's certainly not going to come without warning, but it's definitely going undermine the value of the US dollar and radically impact the US economy. Will there be a recession? Very probably. Will the US recover? Again, probably. Will there be an apocolypse? Highly doubtful.It's actually not a problem at all. Those countries have their own agendas and reasons for doing deals which are political in nature. China and Russia doing deals on the side means nothing when the rest of the world is not following suit. If you want to see if people believe in the ability of the US to tax, look at the USD at ten year highs, look at US Treasury yields approaching multi-decade lows.. your assertion that people are losing faith is based on no facts, you are ignoring all the evidence to the contrary. Let's just say you are right and the US loses it's status.. who is it going to go to? China with their fabricated economy that no one has faith in? Or Europe which is teetering on collapse? There is no one else. Full stop. Period. Besides even if it does happen, that is not a kiss of death. Great Britain was just fine after they lost reserve status, their economy did not collapse and the world kept spinning. I'll tell you one thing, it sure as heck won't be Russia or Brazil or China accepting BTC for their goods and services.
Let's step back and ignore what the market is telling you and also put aside our theories for a second and think: why on Earth would the US all of a sudden not be able to tax its citizens and pay interest on its debt? That is the fundamental question. We have a powerful military to protect us, we have one of the best economies in the world and we have the best legal system in the world. There are no rational or logical reasons to think that the US is on the decline or the dollar is doomed or anything close to that. And looking at interest rates and FX strength you can see the world does agree with that statement.
Quouting the above, The US dollar loses its status as the reserve currency, the question is not who it goes to but what it goes to, look at what all the central banks hold as their reserve assets, the dollar and GOLD! There does not need to be one country with a reserve currency, there is already a backup in place and all the central banks of the world hold it already. Its not going to be game over for the US once it loses its reserve status, after the dust settles I expect they will bounce back as a manufacturing powerhouse and will remain a preeminant world power, it is an incredible and dynamic place.
Consider that China has been buying treasuries throughout this past decade, this is what has given support to the dollar all this time but they have now stopped and started acquiring gold. If the dots havent connected for you yet, well they bumped off Gaddafi after he threatened to sell oil for gold didnt they?
There's a slam dunk argument for hyperinflation right here
http://fofoa.blogspot.co.uk/2012/05/inflation-or-hyperinflation.html
This is a blogger by the name of FOFOA and he is well worth a read.
This house of cards is probably going to pop within the next 5 years, if that and physical gold is going to be the asset to own.
I consider Bitcoin a speculative play right now but if a hyperinflation hits, people will be looking for anywhere to get rid of their fast devaluing Dollars and its pretty easy to buy bitcoin so I can see there being a good chunk of demand and selling drying up in that scenario.
http://fofoa.blogspot.co.uk/2012/05/inflation-or-hyperinflation.html
This is a blogger by the name of FOFOA and he is well worth a read.
This house of cards is probably going to pop within the next 5 years, if that and physical gold is going to be the asset to own.
I consider Bitcoin a speculative play right now but if a hyperinflation hits, people will be looking for anywhere to get rid of their fast devaluing Dollars and its pretty easy to buy bitcoin so I can see there being a good chunk of demand and selling drying up in that scenario.
It'll probably stabilize in the $0-10 range sometime later this year. Maybe some cultists will still HODL their almost worthless coins bought in the three digit range, and some child pornographers and drug addicts will still be using their coins to buy various illegal goods and services on the deep web. That's the best case scenario.
Sweet. $10 is higher than the 0.00 - that is the lowest amount.
Pretty good for something with no inherent value. For a real bottom, Bitcoin has to look like it is dead.
The horror! How far down will this go? Where does it stop?
Answers on a postcard
http://allthingsd.com/files/2012/08/limbo_party.png
Answers on a postcard
http://allthingsd.com/files/2012/08/limbo_party.png
I like your optimism! I think 5k is a good figure for another rally high, but judging by the growth we've seen these past 2 years it seems that baseline growth isnt as fast paced as at once was. You can see that on the line i drew there on the graph. Of course I hope I'm wrong haha
It seems we have returned to the mean, but where will the price be in a couple of years? We are all fascinated by this question, by my estimates based on the past two years growth, I predict we can expect $2k in roughly 2 years and 2 months time. I have used the growth in USD transactions as a basis for the extrapolations in the chart. The price is extracted by dividing USD transactions by 200000, (many thanks to joe200 for this method)
In this maturing market it is clear we have continued network growth despite the falling price, however the price growth is not as rapid as in years past since it at these prices it is far harder to move the market.
One important aspect I have not factored into this extrapolation is the halving in 2016, perhaps we'll see fireworks from this but I'd rather be conservative in my estimates.
http://i.imgur.com/1HlBCG3.png
In this maturing market it is clear we have continued network growth despite the falling price, however the price growth is not as rapid as in years past since it at these prices it is far harder to move the market.
One important aspect I have not factored into this extrapolation is the halving in 2016, perhaps we'll see fireworks from this but I'd rather be conservative in my estimates.
http://i.imgur.com/1HlBCG3.png
Please do not feed the trolls.
I prefer just seeing, "NotLambchop: This user is currently ignored."
http://newsrealblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/dont-feed-the-troll.jpg
I prefer just seeing, "NotLambchop: This user is currently ignored."
http://newsrealblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/dont-feed-the-troll.jpg
This. Even if we consider beanie babies as a legit form of currency they can be "printed" to infinity. The argument they are both "rare" is like trying to say the USD is rare and will never go past X amount of USD in circulation.
If I told someone in the 20's a coffee would be worth $2 they would laugh in my face and say "never would that be possible I don't even earn that in a week". Yet here we are...
Now a 1/100 oz of gold over the coarse of 100 years realtive to buying a coffee.. take a gander at that
.Yes the point I was making is that bitcoin, like gold is rare, there is a set amount in existence, and a limited increase each year as a result of mining and gold is a focal point for wealth (see exter's pyramid), the USD certainly isnt, it can be printed by its issuer at will. Bitcoin has the potential to be a sort of digital gold, how long until the goldbug market want in? That lightbulb moment will click for more people over time and voila $1000 bitcoin in 2015.
Its true the trend cant exponentiate forever, but price is a function of adoption. As long as the network is growing and after this consolidation, there is a good deal of upside left I believe
I've locked down my tins of troll food, they eat facts and soil the place with facetious shit
...
Yes, it's like an IOU, IOU 1 dollar, what defines how much a dollar is? What is the unit of measure? Well believe it or not, the issuer of the IOU gets to define what that is...
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Yes, it's like an IOU, IOU 1 dollar, what defines how much a dollar is? What is the unit of measure? Well believe it or not, the issuer of the IOU gets to define what that is...
...
No. The issuer does not define what the value is. The market defines the value.
When you buy BTCeanie BTCabies, it is your friend--the other finance enthusiast that's selling them to you--who dictates how many dollars you will pay.
You're welcome.
About the real intrinsic value of 1 BTC, the question is:
How Much Money Is There on Earth?
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How Much Money Is There on Earth?
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No. No more than it is the question to ask when trying to establish the "real intrinsic value" of a BTCeanie BTCaby.
If people held beanie babies as a store of wealth, a 'focal point', more can be made to the point where the flow expands. There are a limited number of Bitcoin that will ever exist, they are clearly far more precious
If I make a computer program that spits out 1's & 0's then you trade me your real cash for those computer numbers considering them a "store of wealth"
Then you convince a bunchhhhhhh of people to do the same & everyone starts storing it as a store of wealth.
Where the hell does the wealth come from???
Would you rather be the ones with the real cash? Or the "few" broke people that now have no money but have coins that are just numbers on a computer
DO NOT LET THE "LIMITED TIME SALE" BULLSHIT TACTIC FOOL YOU! Somone want's your money more than you do! POINT BLANK!!!
Where does the wealth come from in a Dollar? It is a debt. Do you realise the government will debase it until it goes to zero?
About the real intrinsic value of 1 BTC, the question is:
How Much Money Is There on Earth?
...
How Much Money Is There on Earth?
...
No. No more than it is the question to ask when trying to establish the "real intrinsic value" of a BTCeanie BTCaby.
If people held beanie babies as a store of wealth, a 'focal point', more can be made to the point where the flow expands. There are a limited number of Bitcoin that will ever exist, they are clearly far more precious
The other aspect to consider is stock to flow, Bitcoin currently holds its value because it is pretty much held tightly. It has an extremely high stock to flow ratio. "Stock" means those who are sitting tight on their Bitcoin, letting it lie still for the future, and "flow" means those who are presently trading their Bitcoin. A limited amount of money can flow through the same Bitcoin many times, over and over, driving it higher and higher with each pass, as long as new Bitcoin is not coaxed out of hiding. And the interesting thing in this process is that it actually causes the opposite of the expected supply/demand reaction. With each pass-through of money more "flow Bitcoin" is moved into "stock Bitcoin", not the other way around like commodities and currency.
Hodlers gonna hodl
Hodlers gonna hodl