I lol'd. For a few minutes actually. Just, the absurdity of it--when I was expecting another "SERIOUS BTC CHART WITH LINES AND DATA" I got--that.

Well done.

To "contribute" to the thread: I don't know if we're going to crash, but I'm glad I bought in.

The red tape is annoying, but I can see the purpose of a lot of it. The idea is to get people to do low cost/no cost upgrades to their home--like getting a programmable thermostat or being more aware of "vampire" loads (flat panel TVs, Blu-Rays, coffee makers, microwaves--basically anything with a clock on it unnecessarily). I also read something about how Germany cut out a lot of their red tape to allow more people got solar installed on their house. This is one instance of the US federal gov't having less red tape than some of the individual state governments.


I love these ideas, thank you very much. If I had to size either an off-grid or a hybrid system for someone, the size of the inverter necessary to power their loads would dictate the number of panels and batteries needed for their system.

In very general terms, here's how it would work for a hybrid system where I live (in the eastern US): I decide which of the outlets in my house I want to serve using my solar panels and batteries. Ideally I determine a "comfort room," something with a few lights, maybe the plugs with tv/cable modem or dsl (comfort and communications). The big questions is: do I need a window air conditioning unit? Once I decide, I get an electrician to wire a sub-panel next to my main service panel. This sub-panel is hooked to an inverter/charger unit. This unit charges my battery bank in one of two ways: (a) the batteries are charged from the solar panels when possible (aka the sun is shining), or (b) the inverter/charger unit will charge the batteries from the grid if solar power is unavailable and the batteries get too low.

This way I save on electricity bills each month by powering some/most of my house with the electricity stored in the batteries generated from solar panels, while at the same time providing backup power to my household during times of grid outages. It's a very popular package (and much less expensive).

Each household has its own questions but if it's me:
1500 sq ft row house, front faces south
Back room is fully insulated on a slab of concrete with only east and north facing windows
Cable modem and wifi located in adjacent closet, refrigerator very close in next room...

This back room is the easiest room to cool in the summer, so it would be a no-brainer to hook up the sub-panel to the outlets here.
Six batteries would be overkill for my needs--I could probably get away with 2. Knowing that, I would likely go with 3 or 4 just to be safe. Ideally I want to have 3 or more days of electricity in case there is no grid power. Solar panels will help replenish what's in the batteries, but for every kwh discharged, I need to put back between 1.1 and 1.35 kwh (in other words, 110% to 135% of what was expended, depending on the battery).

I would need to do a projected usage for each appliance, but if I had a window A/C unit running, my system wouldn't last very long. To be perfectly honest, when the grid goes down, it's all about conservation and making sure I don't let my batteries get too depleted--otherwise they won't come back. My refrigerator is my primary concern, but having a tv/radio in an extended emergency situation can make all the difference.


tl;dr Hybrid solar/battery systems are better and cheaper, but require more planning. Designate a comfort room for when the power goes out.

Ha, point taken, thank you. Luckily, we can sell any of the components separately. The example I used was for a whole system being completely installed--if someone just wants to buy a factory made panel we sell those for around a buck a watt anyway, plus freight.

I think you are absolutely correct about starting with component sales (panels, batteries, inverters, etc.). I may have been overly optimistic to think someone would be willing to purchase a whole solar system with BTC right away  . Plus I have a small post count and am a complete unknown to everyone on here. Earning positive feedback from members by completing hassle-free transactions will help build my credibility with everyone. As I said in my initial post, escrow would be welcomed.

As far as putting together a solar panel from b-grade cells, I've looked into doing that in the past as a weekend project, but the pricing of cells, plus getting a soldering iron and solder, plus the wood or aluminum to build a frame, plus the plexiglass (or whatever) cover to protect the cells, plus the wire and special outdoor waterproof connectors--it was easier and less expensive to just buy a whole panel.

Cranky4u - Thank you for the well wishes, and allow me to reciprocate the sentiment.     One quick note, you mentioned pricing info for a 5kw system, where I was using a 7kw system as an example. There is some profit built into the pricing--we all need to make a living--but my goal is to offer some sort of BTC discount to encourage its adoption and usage (both solar and Bitcoin). My sense is a lot of this hinges on the incentives being applicable for a buyer using a cryptocurrency.

That's awesome directvoltage is accepting those coins, I hope my company will follow suit.

Good stuff here MeltManBob, thank you. The price I mentioned would be for a turnkey system--we also sell just the materials for folks like you who want to do the work themselves or hire local. We are very flexible and I'm hoping to add more flexibility by getting them to accept BTC. You raise some good points though about getting the word out. As others have mentioned, finding the answer to the question of incentive applicability for BTC users is key.

FYI for those looking to do their own research on federal, state, and local solar and renewable energy incentives, this is the most comprehensive and up-to-date listing I know of: http://www.dsireusa.org/


Great points here. One note about the price of panels: computer geeks like me tend to think in terms of Moore's Law, where the speed of processors double every 18 months. In the solar industry the "equivalent" is Swanson's Law, which says the price of PV cells drops 20% for every doubling of industry capacity. This means the price historically hasn't dropped as fast as the price of other technologies, e.g. processors. Unless there is some sort of game-changing technology discovered, we're likely to see that trend continue in the long term. In the short term, prices may actually go up in the US because of new restrictions on panels imported from other countries.

Yes, BTC270 is 270 bitcoins for that system. Solar power isn't the cheapest at the moment, but look at it this way: you're paying for your electricity for the next few decades up front. How many decades is a question of how much the price is now, plus how much will the price increase in 20-30 years.

Yes, the system is warrantied for 25 years on the panels, 10 years for the inverter. Unless you get panels with a microinverter attached (highly recommended for greater efficiency), which have a 25 year warranty for both.

The state of NY and federal government offer significant tax credits and rebates (some of which depend on your utility provider in NY state).

The tax credit and rebate question is a very important one, and I frankly don't have the answer for it yet. The 30% federal credit cuts down the break-even time, and state incentives can bring it down to 4-7 years to pay back. How would the credit work if someone used CAD to pay for a system--would they still be eligible? I will do some research, but that may be a question for a lawyer or CPA. I would love to bring this idea to fruition where I work, so thank you guys for your input on this.

Apologies if this has already been a topic--I searched for "solar" and didn't see anything like this. I am proposing to accept BTC for solar systems/kits.

Solar power has never been cheaper, battery technology has been improving as well. Bitcoin will eventually take over. I think merging my favorite ideas makes perfect sense.

Full disclosure: I have a very modest amount of LTC, and an even smaller amount in BTC (total for both < USD 1000 for now). I don't know if my bosses will go for this, but if there is sufficient interest, I'm going to strenuously insist we accept BTC for solar packages. I am very confident I can persuade them based on preliminary conversations. Assuming they do:

You may have the option of purchasing fully installed systems, depending on where in the eastern USA you are. At the very least we can send kits anywhere in the world to be installed by you or another professional.

Here are some numbers I've run from the Mining Calculator, and I would love some feedback on these. I've rounded up to assume a 1000W system (I see the Avalons are 620W). 1000Wx24h uptime x 365 days = 8,760 kwh. This assumes 100% uptime for the year.

The amount of kwh your solar system produces depends on your latitude, shading, etc. PVWatts is a great resource for figuring this out in the USA. For instance, let's take New York City (not exactly the best for solar at 41 degrees latitude, but ok). If you install a 7kw system (put 7 in the "DC Rating (kW):" field), you should end up with a little over 8500 kwh produced per year. That is extremely close to paying for 100% uptime on Avalons yearly with free solar energy.

Before I go further, I want to gauge people's interest. If we accept BTC as payment for solar systems/kits, who is interested? Based on the current USD/BTC price ($113), the 7kw grid-tied system mentioned above would be around BTC270 installed. The final price depends on where you are and what you want of course--prices will differ around the US/world. Escrow transactions would be welcomed.

*edit to adjust price from BTC250 to BTC270--I apologize, in my haste I didn't take freight, etc. into account.

Definitely interested.

Is your name not Bruce then? That's going to cause a little confusion...

^^

I should have signed up when I first started lurking. In the future, I'll be careful to check if other boards having similar policies.

Newb here but not for much longer...

Newb here, I'd like to be added to the list please:

112Pmmfo8DdndkmzDNrrr3iixs8zceLFs5

Thank you!

Meh it doesn't seem like a terrible policy.