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@Mark, I've been trying to contact you via the email address you previously used since March, but you haven't replied as yet.
I know your life has been thrown into turmoil in recent months, and I understand you have many things to take care of.
I'm certain you will see this post eventually, and when you do, please contact me. We need to talk!
Take care
I know your life has been thrown into turmoil in recent months, and I understand you have many things to take care of.
I'm certain you will see this post eventually, and when you do, please contact me. We need to talk!
Take care
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
Thanks to everyone for their patience!!
ORA MS currency is 'alive', and as fate would have it, 'XOS' / 'ORAshuffle' came into being on July 4th 2015, Independence Day in the USA. This can be a good omen for ORA, as the courage and determination of the American founding fathers to preserve their freedom against tyranny can still inspire us today, and their motivations are still just as relevant in our modern world, probably more so, especially to people working together in a decentralised manner in the crypto movement.
As a non-American myself, I still find these words very inspiring and universal.
While the sentiments of the Declaration of Independence can still inspire us today, we must not forget that the system of government it led to did evolve into something which many of us in the crypto movement are concerned about (i.e. massive state power, often controlled by unelected elites), and the price of freedom will always be constant vigilance against the corrupting influence of power itself. As the crypto movement grows and expands in influence around the globe, we need to remember the lessons of history; the good guys can become the bad guys, if they're not careful!
My hope for the future is that the ORA community stays vigilant, and 'power' & 'influence' over decision making is constantly churned and recycled among an ever changing and evolving group of people! If that happens ORA can have a great future, and make a significant contribution to the spread and adoption of NXT.
Good Luck ORA
ORA MS currency is 'alive', and as fate would have it, 'XOS' / 'ORAshuffle' came into being on July 4th 2015, Independence Day in the USA. This can be a good omen for ORA, as the courage and determination of the American founding fathers to preserve their freedom against tyranny can still inspire us today, and their motivations are still just as relevant in our modern world, probably more so, especially to people working together in a decentralised manner in the crypto movement.
As a non-American myself, I still find these words very inspiring and universal.
Quote
When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the
political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the
earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle
them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes
which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by
their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit
of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving
their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government
becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to
institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in
such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence,
indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and
transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to
suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they
are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same
Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty,
to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Such has
been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains
them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great
Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the
establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a
candid world.
political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the
earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle
them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes
which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by
their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit
of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving
their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government
becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to
institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in
such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence,
indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and
transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to
suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they
are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same
Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty,
to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Such has
been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains
them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great
Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the
establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a
candid world.
While the sentiments of the Declaration of Independence can still inspire us today, we must not forget that the system of government it led to did evolve into something which many of us in the crypto movement are concerned about (i.e. massive state power, often controlled by unelected elites), and the price of freedom will always be constant vigilance against the corrupting influence of power itself. As the crypto movement grows and expands in influence around the globe, we need to remember the lessons of history; the good guys can become the bad guys, if they're not careful!
My hope for the future is that the ORA community stays vigilant, and 'power' & 'influence' over decision making is constantly churned and recycled among an ever changing and evolving group of people! If that happens ORA can have a great future, and make a significant contribution to the spread and adoption of NXT.
Good Luck ORA
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
Update
It looks the consensus is to re-issue another ORA MS, which is fine by me!
I've created two new ORA MS currencies (one with 2 decimals, one with 4 decimals) on the NXT testnet and Nxter is running some tests on his distribution scripts. Once everything looks OK, I'll re-issue the new MS on the live NXT, transfer to Nxter, and then we'll start the redemption process.
Thanks for being patient everyone, not long now
It looks the consensus is to re-issue another ORA MS, which is fine by me!
I've created two new ORA MS currencies (one with 2 decimals, one with 4 decimals) on the NXT testnet and Nxter is running some tests on his distribution scripts. Once everything looks OK, I'll re-issue the new MS on the live NXT, transfer to Nxter, and then we'll start the redemption process.
Thanks for being patient everyone, not long now
Unfortunately I have not received any new ORA assets. I sent you the transaction id to my transaction to Darkhorse.
Hi tyz,
We're still deciding whether we continue with the original XORA MS, or do we re-issue another MS without any problems with the decimals. Once the decision has been made we'll restart the redemption.
thanks
I'm going to lock this thread now.
For all things ORA go here:
https://nxtforum.org/ora/
and here
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1036574.0
thanks everyone!!
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
I've started a poll to help us make the decision on whether we keep XORA or re-issue
https://nxtforum.org/ora/ora-community-vote-xora-re-issue/
Please vote!!
https://nxtforum.org/ora/ora-community-vote-xora-re-issue/
Please vote!!
jl777 has suggested a third option in the poll
3. keep it as is, as there is no peg and using InstantDEX we get effective decimals
I really can't fathom the ramifications- I'll vote later
I know what you mean
If we were to achieve overwhelming support from the NXT community (i.e. over 90% support and LOTS of people voting), then the net effect would be to effectively double the marketcap of the NXT token ecosystem. NXT is worth 1 billion NXT, and XORA is worth 1 billion NXT. That extra billion of wealth *could* solve a lot of funding problems for NXT.
BUT, it's obviously very difficult to get that level of unambiguous community support, and it would be seen as very 'controversial' by many people. We all know the typical criticism of the NXT distribution and the 73 IPO people. But that was BCNext's prerogative as the creator of NXT!
Imagine the response to XORA? A relatively obscure crypto project decides to create a billion XORA MS coins out of thin air to create the 'defacto shuffle' coin for the whole of NXT, and then pegs them to 1 NXT each, making some people very wealthy overnight! Despite being a GREAT idea (good for the shuffle idea, possible ongoing funding source for NXT) it's obviously going to be very difficult to 'sell' to the wider crypto community, especially if we don't even have strong majority support at home amongst average NXT'ers.
The outcome if we keep XORA with the 1:1, but we eventually FAIL to get overwhelming support is ORA would be dead, BUT, NXT itself would be unharmed. That's OK IMO, we would have tried for the best outcome and failed.
The outcome if we keep XORA with the 1:1, and we SUCCEED, and we do get overwhelming support for keeping XORA is ORA becomes a beautiful 'starfish' in the NXT ecosystem, and NXT has great anonymous features through shuffling, AND, NXT has another source of community funding. That's awesome!!
The outcome if we re-issue without the 1:1 limitation is we keep working on ORA, and we still have a shot at making the new ORA MS currency the default shuffle coin over time. That's pretty OK too!
Everything obviously hinges on getting massive community wide support for keeping XORA, and hopefully it'll be really obvious if we achieve that, so we don't keep XORA and fail.
IMO it's very unlikely we will get massive unambuguous support (e.g. Berlin Wall 1989, Arab Spring, Beatlemania etc), but it's still well worth the attempt!!
Alice has 166,000 XORA, Bob says I will pay $100 for it. Alice agrees and they swap
this cannot be stopped.
so if you "peg" it significantly above market price, them all liquidity of whatever is pegging it will be exhausted (see soros vs England) and then it will trade at its market price (with big spreads and lack of liquidity)
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
I've started a poll to help us make the decision on whether we keep XORA or re-issue
https://nxtforum.org/ora/ora-community-vote-xora-re-issue/
Please vote!!
https://nxtforum.org/ora/ora-community-vote-xora-re-issue/
Please vote!!
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
Update
Some important decisions regarding ORA are currently under discussion.
When I created the XORA MS currency I set the decimals for the currency to 8 (the same as NXT). This had the unintended consequence of making it impossible to trade XORA for fractional NXT amounts in the currency booth of the NXT NRS software, and thus, artificially sets the floor price inside the NXT exchange booth (outside the NXT NRS software people can trade XORA at any rate).
1 XORA = 1 NXT
Initially this 'mistake' on my part did seem to lead to the obvious conclusion that we would need to re-issue another MS with 4 decimals, which would allow a free floating exchange rate between XORA & NXT in the MS currency booth of the NXT software (Nxter had already distributed some XORA to the MIC & ORA redemptions in DH's old account before the 8 decimal problem was discovered, so we couldn't edit the XORA settings anymore).
BUT, Jack Needles has very eloquently argued that having the artificial 1:1 floor price for XORA WOULD add some very nice features that *might* actually benefit XORA as a 'shuffle' MS!
AND, the 1:1 would mean existing ORA holders experienced a massive windfall gain - 1 XORA = 1 NXT!
SO ... we have to decide what to do ... do we re-issue another MS for ORA with a free floating exchange, or do we keep the existing 'XORA' with the 1:1 exchange rate locked in, and if so, how do we use the 'windfall' to generate MASSIVE community support for ORA?
To learn more, and hopefully have your say on what we should do head over to the NXT forum and 'express yourself'!!!
https://nxtforum.org/ora/(ann)-new-final-ora-and-mic-assets-redemption-process-last-call/
We're very close to achieving official 'interesting' status for ORA, but we need support and feedback to make it happen!
Some important decisions regarding ORA are currently under discussion.
When I created the XORA MS currency I set the decimals for the currency to 8 (the same as NXT). This had the unintended consequence of making it impossible to trade XORA for fractional NXT amounts in the currency booth of the NXT NRS software, and thus, artificially sets the floor price inside the NXT exchange booth (outside the NXT NRS software people can trade XORA at any rate).
1 XORA = 1 NXT
Initially this 'mistake' on my part did seem to lead to the obvious conclusion that we would need to re-issue another MS with 4 decimals, which would allow a free floating exchange rate between XORA & NXT in the MS currency booth of the NXT software (Nxter had already distributed some XORA to the MIC & ORA redemptions in DH's old account before the 8 decimal problem was discovered, so we couldn't edit the XORA settings anymore).
BUT, Jack Needles has very eloquently argued that having the artificial 1:1 floor price for XORA WOULD add some very nice features that *might* actually benefit XORA as a 'shuffle' MS!
AND, the 1:1 would mean existing ORA holders experienced a massive windfall gain - 1 XORA = 1 NXT!
SO ... we have to decide what to do ... do we re-issue another MS for ORA with a free floating exchange, or do we keep the existing 'XORA' with the 1:1 exchange rate locked in, and if so, how do we use the 'windfall' to generate MASSIVE community support for ORA?
To learn more, and hopefully have your say on what we should do head over to the NXT forum and 'express yourself'!!!
https://nxtforum.org/ora/(ann)-new-final-ora-and-mic-assets-redemption-process-last-call/
We're very close to achieving official 'interesting' status for ORA, but we need support and feedback to make it happen!
The news we've all been waiting for!!
Hi community,
The distribution of the ORA currency has re-started. The currency is already in circulation, 127 users that sent their assets to the old redemption account have been already honored.
To obtain your MS currency send all you MIC and ORA assets to the ORA currency distribution account: NXT-E26D-DMFT-N8XV-37PBS
They will be redeemed by the ORA currency of the monetary system, ticker: XORA http://nxtportal.org/currencies/6933225670038769986
The deadline to redeem your assets will be announced soon.
Br,
Nxter.
Thanks to everyone for being patient, and a BIG thanks to Nxter
ANNOUNCEMENT
Hi community,
The distribution of the ORA currency has re-started. The currency is already in circulation, 127 users that sent their assets to the old redemption account have been already honored.
To obtain your MS currency send all you MIC and ORA assets to the ORA currency distribution account: NXT-E26D-DMFT-N8XV-37PBS
They will be redeemed by the ORA currency of the monetary system, ticker: XORA http://nxtportal.org/currencies/6933225670038769986
The deadline to redeem your assets will be announced soon.
Br,
Nxter.
Thanks to everyone for being patient, and a BIG thanks to Nxter
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
The news we've all been waiting for!!
Hi community,
The distribution of the ORA currency has re-started. The currency is already in circulation, 127 users that sent their assets to the old redemption account have been already honored.
To obtain your MS currency send all you MIC and ORA assets to the ORA currency distribution account: NXT-E26D-DMFT-N8XV-37PBS
They will be redeemed by the ORA currency of the monetary system, ticker: XORA http://nxtportal.org/currencies/6933225670038769986
The deadline to redeem your assets will be announced soon.
Br,
Nxter.
Thanks to everyone for being patient, and a BIG thanks to Nxter
ANNOUNCEMENT
Hi community,
The distribution of the ORA currency has re-started. The currency is already in circulation, 127 users that sent their assets to the old redemption account have been already honored.
To obtain your MS currency send all you MIC and ORA assets to the ORA currency distribution account: NXT-E26D-DMFT-N8XV-37PBS
They will be redeemed by the ORA currency of the monetary system, ticker: XORA http://nxtportal.org/currencies/6933225670038769986
The deadline to redeem your assets will be announced soon.
Br,
Nxter.
Thanks to everyone for being patient, and a BIG thanks to Nxter
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
I still have a bunch of the original tokens left which I did not send in before Darkhorse disappeared- where am I supposed to send them?
The community treasurers should be making an announcement soon! Nxter said this earlier today:
Hi,
I have setup an account to act as initial ORA treasury: NXT-LR35-7YFJ-C3CJ-H5EBZ http://nxtportal.org/accounts/18421274091316665379
KORA you may send the XORA to it.
Since account control (multi-signature wallets) is not yet available, the current ORA treasurers (fragora, pilot and me) will share the private key of the treasury account. This will avoid that the funds get locked up forever in the case I should get hit by a bus.
Once the treasury gets the currency XORA from Kora, we will set up a another account to redeem MIC and ORA assets. And of course, the first step in the redemption process will be to honor with XORA currency all of those pleople who already sent ORA and MIC assets to Darkhorse. Please, stay tuned.
I have setup an account to act as initial ORA treasury: NXT-LR35-7YFJ-C3CJ-H5EBZ http://nxtportal.org/accounts/18421274091316665379
KORA you may send the XORA to it.
Since account control (multi-signature wallets) is not yet available, the current ORA treasurers (fragora, pilot and me) will share the private key of the treasury account. This will avoid that the funds get locked up forever in the case I should get hit by a bus.
Once the treasury gets the currency XORA from Kora, we will set up a another account to redeem MIC and ORA assets. And of course, the first step in the redemption process will be to honor with XORA currency all of those pleople who already sent ORA and MIC assets to Darkhorse. Please, stay tuned.
I've sent all 1 billion XORA to Nxter's new treasury account, so everything is in place to re-start the redemptions for MIC & ORA!!
Hey everyone!!
Very good news for project ORA lately.
MIC & ORA redemptions will start again soon, and all previous redemptions to Darkhorse's original treasury account WILL be honored.
An announcement from the community treasurers should be coming soonish.
Discussion has mostly moved over to the nxtforum, come and join us there:
https://nxtforum.org/ora/(ann)oranxt-ms-currency'shuffling'-for-nxtjl777-involvedanon-fungibility/
We also created a newer thread on bitcointalk when we started exploring the 'ORA::shuffle' idea Jack Needles suggested:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1036574.0
I might lock this old thread in a couple of days.
Having survived some difficult times in the past, project ORA is now moving ahead with some solid momentum, and I believe XORA can have a bright future as the NXT communities 'go-to' shuffle MS coin, but we still have a lot of work to do!
We always welcome feedback and ideas, and everyone is invited to get involved
Very good news for project ORA lately.
- Our new community treasurers (pilot, fragora & Nxter) have created a new treasury account
- I've created the new 'XORA' MS currency - http://nxtportal.org/currencies/6933225670038769986
- I have transferred all 1 billion XORA over to the new treasury account Nxter created earlier today
MIC & ORA redemptions will start again soon, and all previous redemptions to Darkhorse's original treasury account WILL be honored.
An announcement from the community treasurers should be coming soonish.
Discussion has mostly moved over to the nxtforum, come and join us there:
https://nxtforum.org/ora/(ann)oranxt-ms-currency'shuffling'-for-nxtjl777-involvedanon-fungibility/
We also created a newer thread on bitcointalk when we started exploring the 'ORA::shuffle' idea Jack Needles suggested:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1036574.0
I might lock this old thread in a couple of days.
Having survived some difficult times in the past, project ORA is now moving ahead with some solid momentum, and I believe XORA can have a bright future as the NXT communities 'go-to' shuffle MS coin, but we still have a lot of work to do!
We always welcome feedback and ideas, and everyone is invited to get involved
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
Update
Good news everyone, I have created the new 'XORA' MS currency!!
This is 'XORA' MS - http://nxtportal.org/currencies/6933225670038769986
Even better news in many ways, we have been fortunate to attract another volunteer community treasurer to help out with the ORA & MIC redemptions and the next stage of the distribution.
I'm incredibly happy to introduce nxtforum.org member Nxter as a new member of the ORA community treasury team! I'm sure everyone will be as happy as I am to have another community treasurer on-board to help keep ORA viable as a community based project!
A BIG thanks to Nxter
I will transfer 100% of the XORA coins to the community treasury account(s) once the treasurers have setup their new treasury accounts & procedures.
It's been a good week for ORA
Good news everyone, I have created the new 'XORA' MS currency!!
This is 'XORA' MS - http://nxtportal.org/currencies/6933225670038769986
Even better news in many ways, we have been fortunate to attract another volunteer community treasurer to help out with the ORA & MIC redemptions and the next stage of the distribution.
I'm incredibly happy to introduce nxtforum.org member Nxter as a new member of the ORA community treasury team! I'm sure everyone will be as happy as I am to have another community treasurer on-board to help keep ORA viable as a community based project!
A BIG thanks to Nxter
Hi ORERS.
I would like to step out and volunteer myself to help with the ORA treasury and accounting along fragora and pilot (if they and the community agree).
I spend time everyday in this forum and I think it is time to move from being a simple observer to be an active member of the community. The ORA project is the perfect place to do so.
I am an ORA believer, I am an original stakeholder from the web application and I not only keep the whole stake from the original distribution but I also bought some extra ORA in the AE.
I would like to step out and volunteer myself to help with the ORA treasury and accounting along fragora and pilot (if they and the community agree).
I spend time everyday in this forum and I think it is time to move from being a simple observer to be an active member of the community. The ORA project is the perfect place to do so.
I am an ORA believer, I am an original stakeholder from the web application and I not only keep the whole stake from the original distribution but I also bought some extra ORA in the AE.
I will transfer 100% of the XORA coins to the community treasury account(s) once the treasurers have setup their new treasury accounts & procedures.
It's been a good week for ORA
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
is this connected to supernet then? I haven't heard about it in a while
ORA isn't part of SuperNET, but we are trying to position ourselves as the default 'shuffle' MS currency for NXT ( shuffle tech adds anon functionality to NXT ecosystem), and jl777 has kindly offered to help us. We are planning to distribute some ORA MS coins to SuperNET asset holders via a dividend, so that would mean every SuperNET hodler would be an 'ORA::shuffle' hodler too!
So we're not part of SuperNET as such, but I think it's fair to say we're definitely 'brothers in arms' in a real sense.
I think you should just create a summary of the discussion with a link to the forum post instead of posting the entirety of the exchange here.
A concise what, why, who, how and when will work so much better.
Thanks for the feedback! I have often been uncertain on how best to communicate the vision for ORA and what's going on in a way that encourages people to get involved with the project, so I appreciate your suggestion. I do agree that concise summaries would be easier for casual followers of ORA to digest, but at this stage of the project (the calm before the storm, hopefully), there honestly isn't a lot of discussion going on, so copy/pasting whole posts probably doesn't hurt too much. I've probably done all I can to outline my vision for a leaderless decentralised community based 'starfish' project, so my function as the catylyst for ORA is coming to an end, and I'm really just trying to keep communication channels oiled in the hope that others start to appreciate the potential with ORA::shuffle and get inspired to get involved..
I think there's enough detail in the roadmap to make ORA 'work', so it's down to actions now, but not really from me at this time, and I guess that's why I'm less inclined to summarise things. Over the last 12 months I think I've explained my thoughts on what ORA *could* be in some detail, so now it's probably time for me to pull back a bit and let others take the lead. It did feel a bit weird to post 100% of my PM exchanges with jl777 for example, but I do honestly want ORA to be leaderless and decentralised, and for that to be a real possibility everyone needs access to all the information. Past events have confirmed to me that other people usually have better ideas for how to proceed than me anyway, and I'm ready to offer support to any capable people who feel inclined to get involved now.
"ORA::shuffle, default NXT anon MS coin" - getting to this point was difficult, and I'm personally very excited at the possible future ahead, but it's really just the jumping off point, and getting here with a viable plan and a viable community to make it happen was always what I saw as my chief roll. What happens next is sort of out of my hands now, as it should be in a leaderless starfish project, and that's exciting,but a little scary too.
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
is this connected to supernet then? I haven't heard about it in a while
ORA isn't part of SuperNET, but we are trying to position ourselves as the default 'shuffle' MS currency for NXT ( shuffle tech adds anon functionality to NXT ecosystem), and jl777 has kindly offered to help us. We are planning to distribute some ORA MS coins to SuperNET asset holders via a dividend, so that would mean every SuperNET hodler would be an 'ORA::shuffle' hodler too!
So we're not part of SuperNET as such, but I think it's fair to say we're definitely 'brothers in arms' in a real sense.
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
So it's getting close to the deadline we set for Darkhorse to return (ORA's first birthday on 22 May), so we should start firming up our game plan. The first task on the roadmap is:
so, if Pilot & frag are still 'go' for 'ORA::shuffle' MS launch, then .... over to Pilot & frag to flick the ignition switch! I will cover the costs of all tx fees etc.
It does appear that DH is unlikely to come back, and that means we can't use the 'XOR' primo 3 character MS name he registered on the projects behalf. I do feel the loss of the 25K NXT listing fee, but honestly, the loss of the 'XOR' name hurts more. It was a cool name for 'ORA::shuffle', but it's locked up in an account we can't access! Frustration!!!
Anyway, time to move on. Hopefully DH is alright, and I bare him no ill feeling at all. DH was/is a good guy, and I'm 100% convinced his going missing couldn't be helped on his part!
One thing I would like to open up for further discussion is 'NXTignite', a new service being offered by NXTinspect.
https://nxtforum.org/asset-exchange-general/nxtignite-a-nxtinspect-(nxti)-mentorship-program/msg179192/#msg179192
Could 'ORA::shuffle' benefit from using the services of NXTignite? We have a good roadmap, but lets be honest, the ORA starfish is still quite weak, and with DH gone we have lost a permanent long-term community treasurer who was genuinely enthused for a long term commitment as the main guy co-ordinating the funds. My suggestion assumes Pilot & frag are stepping up for a 'short & sweet' burst of energy only, and aren't committing to ORA treasurer duties in an ongoing capacity into the future. If they are keen to stay on as long term treasurers, well that would be more than cool, but if they're not (i.e they're just volunteering to get the first task completed as outlined above), then maybe NXTignite could help. The escrow service looks viable as a possible long term community treasury of sorts.
I'll let Pilot & frag speak for themselves, and whatever they decide is more than cool with me, and I'm truly grateful for any help anyone can offer ORA, especially as we're a community project. I just wanted to put the NXTignite idea out there for further discussion.
NXTignite would give the ORA starfish a little more 'backbone', and exploring the option can't hurt.
Quote
Short term Treasurers (Pilot & fragora):
- recreate ORA MS treasury account & MS currency
- re-create balances from transactions in DH's redemption accounts
- continue MIC & ORA asset redemptions
- create new ORA MS currency
- distribute 100% of ORA MS
1- to users
2- to other community members for other purposes (i.e. apenzl/NXTER.org & jl777/SuperNET & long term treasurers)
- recreate ORA MS treasury account & MS currency
- re-create balances from transactions in DH's redemption accounts
- continue MIC & ORA asset redemptions
- create new ORA MS currency
- distribute 100% of ORA MS
1- to users
2- to other community members for other purposes (i.e. apenzl/NXTER.org & jl777/SuperNET & long term treasurers)
so, if Pilot & frag are still 'go' for 'ORA::shuffle' MS launch, then .... over to Pilot & frag to flick the ignition switch! I will cover the costs of all tx fees etc.
It does appear that DH is unlikely to come back, and that means we can't use the 'XOR' primo 3 character MS name he registered on the projects behalf. I do feel the loss of the 25K NXT listing fee, but honestly, the loss of the 'XOR' name hurts more. It was a cool name for 'ORA::shuffle', but it's locked up in an account we can't access! Frustration!!!
Anyway, time to move on. Hopefully DH is alright, and I bare him no ill feeling at all. DH was/is a good guy, and I'm 100% convinced his going missing couldn't be helped on his part!
One thing I would like to open up for further discussion is 'NXTignite', a new service being offered by NXTinspect.
https://nxtforum.org/asset-exchange-general/nxtignite-a-nxtinspect-(nxti)-mentorship-program/msg179192/#msg179192
Could 'ORA::shuffle' benefit from using the services of NXTignite? We have a good roadmap, but lets be honest, the ORA starfish is still quite weak, and with DH gone we have lost a permanent long-term community treasurer who was genuinely enthused for a long term commitment as the main guy co-ordinating the funds. My suggestion assumes Pilot & frag are stepping up for a 'short & sweet' burst of energy only, and aren't committing to ORA treasurer duties in an ongoing capacity into the future. If they are keen to stay on as long term treasurers, well that would be more than cool, but if they're not (i.e they're just volunteering to get the first task completed as outlined above), then maybe NXTignite could help. The escrow service looks viable as a possible long term community treasury of sorts.
I'll let Pilot & frag speak for themselves, and whatever they decide is more than cool with me, and I'm truly grateful for any help anyone can offer ORA, especially as we're a community project. I just wanted to put the NXTignite idea out there for further discussion.
NXTignite would give the ORA starfish a little more 'backbone', and exploring the option can't hurt.
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
Hi everyone, just re-posting this nxtforum.org post here for ALL interested ORAfarians
Thanks for all your support frag!!
I agree that the key to success for ORA::shuffle will be getting the 'right' dev to design & code the shuffle plugin, and jl777 & team SuperNET are definitely the right people to help with that critical task. Obviously James is up to his eyeballs with InstantDEX testing at the moment (and other projects no doubt also), but if the rest of us can line up all the other 'pins' then I fully expect James will send down a 'strike' with the tech when the time is right. We have plenty of tasks to complete before then, and we still need to build strong community support & engagement before any of us will really know if ORA::Shuffle has a reasonable chance of success.
We don't have any time limits with this project, and ORA & MIC hodlers have already shown they're in for the long haul, so I think ALL ORA shufflers have sufficient patience to wait, watch & observe, and hopefully some will get more involved as we make progress with the roadmap.
Thanks Mac, as the game show hosts like to say, I'm going to lock those numbers in place now. We can revisit them later if need be, but for now lets work on the basis that the 'ORA::Shuffle' roadmap is:
Good work Mac! I'll try and make a start on some basic text for the orashuffle.com website. As Mac said, everyone is more than welcome to contribute text and ideas for the new website.
I'm also going to point out that ORA starfish will turn 'one' on 22nd May 2015 (one year from my original bitcointalk.org forum announcement post). We've come a long way since then, and I'm personally very grateful to all those who have helped along the way and shown interest & support. I'm going to suggest that we set that date - 22nd May 2015 - as our cut-off date for Darkhorse to return, so unless we hear from DH before then I suggest we create the new 'ORA::shuffle' MS currency on that date and proceed with the first task, assuming Pilot & fragora are still willing to act as short-term community treasurers.
Great posts Kora and I am on board to help in any way I can, but I think filling the other roles is just a formality and this one is key --
delegated task to jl777 & team SuperNET
- recruit & pay shuffle dev
- determine how best to implement shuffle reward payment (including amount) to incentivise shuffling
delegated task to jl777 & team SuperNET
- recruit & pay shuffle dev
- determine how best to implement shuffle reward payment (including amount) to incentivise shuffling
Thanks for all your support frag!!
I agree that the key to success for ORA::shuffle will be getting the 'right' dev to design & code the shuffle plugin, and jl777 & team SuperNET are definitely the right people to help with that critical task. Obviously James is up to his eyeballs with InstantDEX testing at the moment (and other projects no doubt also), but if the rest of us can line up all the other 'pins' then I fully expect James will send down a 'strike' with the tech when the time is right. We have plenty of tasks to complete before then, and we still need to build strong community support & engagement before any of us will really know if ORA::Shuffle has a reasonable chance of success.
We don't have any time limits with this project, and ORA & MIC hodlers have already shown they're in for the long haul, so I think ALL ORA shufflers have sufficient patience to wait, watch & observe, and hopefully some will get more involved as we make progress with the roadmap.
Those numbers look solid to me.
Thanks Mac, as the game show hosts like to say, I'm going to lock those numbers in place now. We can revisit them later if need be, but for now lets work on the basis that the 'ORA::Shuffle' roadmap is:
Quote
'ORA::Shuffle' - semi-official provisional RoadMap
The distro:
10% - jl777 SNcoin swap
10% - SuperNET dividend
5% - Mac Red (Webapp Dev) - Paid
5% - shuffle plugin dev
2% - Kora expense account - Paid
1.0% - Darkhorse - community treasurer
1.0% - Fragora - community treasurer & CryptoFest.tv dev
14.7% - ORA webapp distribution (890 stakeholders X 166,000 = 147,740,000 XOR)
12.5% - MIC assimilation (250,000,000 MIC X 0.5 = 125,000,000 XOR)
16% - Power Bounties & community funds
22.8% - unallocated funds
So we have 38.8% in power bounties & community funds, and unallocated funds.
My Roadmap suggestion is as follows:
1- complete distro numbers
2- determine tasks needed to make ORA a leaderlss DAC/DAO
2- delegate tasks to volunteers (i.e. 100% decision making power on how best to execute that task rests with the person who volunteered for the task)
3- volunteers execute tasks as best they can
4- everyone tries to stay 'engaged' in the future
I'm suggesting the following distro for the remaining 38.8%:
20.8% - shuffle rewards (1,000,000 ORA per week for 4 years)
10% - promotion & further distribution
8% - long term community funds (ideally 4 individuals with 2% each)
Task list:
Short term Treasurers (Pilot & fragora):
- recreate ORA MS treasury account & MS currency
- re-create balances from transactions in DH's redemption accounts
- continue MIC & ORA asset redemptions
- create new ORA MS currency
- distribute 100% of ORA MS
1- to users
2- to other community members for other purposes (i.e. apenzl/NXTER.org & jl777/SuperNET & long term treasurers)
Promotion & further distro (NXTER.org & apenzl):
delegated task to apenzl & NXTER.org
- Promote 'ORA::shuffle' by distributing ORA in interesting ways (e.g. nxtforum.org giveaway, NXT dev team, CryptoFest etc etc)
Shuffle plugin tech (jl777 & team SuperNET):
delegated task to jl777 & team SuperNET
- recruit & pay shuffle dev
- determine how best to implement shuffle reward payment (including amount) to incentivise shuffling
Long term Community Treasurers: (unknown, looking for volunteers, Pilot & fragora if they want could retain their positions)
delegated task
- receive ORA from short term treasurers
- react to future developments in consultation with other NXT & ORA community members as needed
A few notes:
- unclaimed MIC & ORA should go into shuffle rewards pool
- Kora will pay tx fees for sending redeemed coins to ORA+MIC holders etc
- Kora will use remaining ~10M ORA from his 2% expense account to pay bounties to Pilot, Jack Needles, apenzl, jl777 etc
- DH's 1% share?? if DH doesn't return we share it between long term treasurers, or back into shuffle rewards pool?
- investigate automation for distribution of new MS currency
- who keeps SuperNET silver coins ... jl777 or long term treasuers?
- Mac Red is making a new ORA website - maybe work with apenzl & NXTER.org
The distro:
10% - jl777 SNcoin swap
10% - SuperNET dividend
5% - Mac Red (Webapp Dev) - Paid
5% - shuffle plugin dev
2% - Kora expense account - Paid
1.0% - Darkhorse - community treasurer
1.0% - Fragora - community treasurer & CryptoFest.tv dev
14.7% - ORA webapp distribution (890 stakeholders X 166,000 = 147,740,000 XOR)
12.5% - MIC assimilation (250,000,000 MIC X 0.5 = 125,000,000 XOR)
16% - Power Bounties & community funds
22.8% - unallocated funds
So we have 38.8% in power bounties & community funds, and unallocated funds.
My Roadmap suggestion is as follows:
1- complete distro numbers
2- determine tasks needed to make ORA a leaderlss DAC/DAO
2- delegate tasks to volunteers (i.e. 100% decision making power on how best to execute that task rests with the person who volunteered for the task)
3- volunteers execute tasks as best they can
4- everyone tries to stay 'engaged' in the future
I'm suggesting the following distro for the remaining 38.8%:
20.8% - shuffle rewards (1,000,000 ORA per week for 4 years)
10% - promotion & further distribution
8% - long term community funds (ideally 4 individuals with 2% each)
Task list:
Short term Treasurers (Pilot & fragora):
- recreate ORA MS treasury account & MS currency
- re-create balances from transactions in DH's redemption accounts
- continue MIC & ORA asset redemptions
- create new ORA MS currency
- distribute 100% of ORA MS
1- to users
2- to other community members for other purposes (i.e. apenzl/NXTER.org & jl777/SuperNET & long term treasurers)
Promotion & further distro (NXTER.org & apenzl):
delegated task to apenzl & NXTER.org
- Promote 'ORA::shuffle' by distributing ORA in interesting ways (e.g. nxtforum.org giveaway, NXT dev team, CryptoFest etc etc)
Shuffle plugin tech (jl777 & team SuperNET):
delegated task to jl777 & team SuperNET
- recruit & pay shuffle dev
- determine how best to implement shuffle reward payment (including amount) to incentivise shuffling
Long term Community Treasurers: (unknown, looking for volunteers, Pilot & fragora if they want could retain their positions)
delegated task
- receive ORA from short term treasurers
- react to future developments in consultation with other NXT & ORA community members as needed
A few notes:
- unclaimed MIC & ORA should go into shuffle rewards pool
- Kora will pay tx fees for sending redeemed coins to ORA+MIC holders etc
- Kora will use remaining ~10M ORA from his 2% expense account to pay bounties to Pilot, Jack Needles, apenzl, jl777 etc
- DH's 1% share?? if DH doesn't return we share it between long term treasurers, or back into shuffle rewards pool?
- investigate automation for distribution of new MS currency
- who keeps SuperNET silver coins ... jl777 or long term treasuers?
- Mac Red is making a new ORA website - maybe work with apenzl & NXTER.org
Like kora mentioned I'm setting up a website to help with the promotion. Nothing fancy, a simple one-page site with room for general information and links. But with a design that IMO fits the new direction we're heading. It's 99.9% done development-wise and is ready to be filled with some actual content. Kora's agreed to help write some text, but anyone's welcome to contribute, just let me know. We'll be able to launch this site whenever we feel it'd be a good time to do so.
Good work Mac! I'll try and make a start on some basic text for the orashuffle.com website. As Mac said, everyone is more than welcome to contribute text and ideas for the new website.
I'm also going to point out that ORA starfish will turn 'one' on 22nd May 2015 (one year from my original bitcointalk.org forum announcement post). We've come a long way since then, and I'm personally very grateful to all those who have helped along the way and shown interest & support. I'm going to suggest that we set that date - 22nd May 2015 - as our cut-off date for Darkhorse to return, so unless we hear from DH before then I suggest we create the new 'ORA::shuffle' MS currency on that date and proceed with the first task, assuming Pilot & fragora are still willing to act as short-term community treasurers.
Quote
Short term Treasurers (Pilot & fragora):
- recreate ORA MS treasury account & MS currency
- re-create balances from transactions in DH's redemption accounts
- continue MIC & ORA asset redemptions
- create new ORA MS currency
- distribute 100% of ORA MS
1- to users
2- to other community members for other purposes (i.e. apenzl/NXTER.org & jl777/SuperNET & long term treasurers)
- recreate ORA MS treasury account & MS currency
- re-create balances from transactions in DH's redemption accounts
- continue MIC & ORA asset redemptions
- create new ORA MS currency
- distribute 100% of ORA MS
1- to users
2- to other community members for other purposes (i.e. apenzl/NXTER.org & jl777/SuperNET & long term treasurers)
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
Hey ORA'farians!
I suggest everyone who's following ORA and the recent discussion on the possible 'default shuffle MS coin' keep track of the discussions on nxtforum.org from now on.
As a NXT MS currency that's where the 'hearts & minds' of the majority of our community hang out.
Join in and have your say, we have our own 'child' board!
The future of ORA is being decided as I write, so head on over and express yourself!!
ORA needs your love ... TODAY
https://nxtforum.org/ora/
I suggest everyone who's following ORA and the recent discussion on the possible 'default shuffle MS coin' keep track of the discussions on nxtforum.org from now on.
As a NXT MS currency that's where the 'hearts & minds' of the majority of our community hang out.
Join in and have your say, we have our own 'child' board!
The future of ORA is being decided as I write, so head on over and express yourself!!
ORA needs your love ... TODAY
https://nxtforum.org/ora/
Hey ORA'farians!
I suggest everyone who's following ORA and the recent discussion on the possible 'default shuffle MS coin' keep track of the discussions on nxtforum.org from now on.
As a NXT MS currency that's where the 'hearts & minds' of the majority of our community hang out.
Join in and have your say, we have our own 'child' board!
The future of ORA is being decided as I write, so head on over and express yourself!!
ORA needs your love ... TODAY
https://nxtforum.org/ora/
I suggest everyone who's following ORA and the recent discussion on the possible 'default shuffle MS coin' keep track of the discussions on nxtforum.org from now on.
As a NXT MS currency that's where the 'hearts & minds' of the majority of our community hang out.
Join in and have your say, we have our own 'child' board!
The future of ORA is being decided as I write, so head on over and express yourself!!
ORA needs your love ... TODAY
https://nxtforum.org/ora/
Re: [ANN] ORA :: NXT 'monetary system' currency, interested in ancient coin ?
Are you interested in exchanging of ORA/XOR for 50,000 tokens of one ancient (older than NXT) and rare coin that is very hard to obtain in large quantities in a short period of time (unless you buy it from me or somebody else) even if you rented all calculating power in the world for that short period of time.
I believe this coin can be near perfect model for ideal distribution that ORA&NEM were trying to achieve.
I bought them for 1 cent a piece, how many ORAs, NEMs, XORas, QORAs or NXTs are you willing to give me for those 50K tokens ?
To get good NXT or QORA price I don't mind to get it through an escrow, which would release your part to me after 6 months to make sure I don't create competitive sell pressure for your distribution.
I also got around 15 mil of useless NAS on dgex if dgex is willing to cooperate and send them to you, I will give them my command to do so.
I believe this coin can be near perfect model for ideal distribution that ORA&NEM were trying to achieve.
I bought them for 1 cent a piece, how many ORAs, NEMs, XORas, QORAs or NXTs are you willing to give me for those 50K tokens ?
To get good NXT or QORA price I don't mind to get it through an escrow, which would release your part to me after 6 months to make sure I don't create competitive sell pressure for your distribution.
I also got around 15 mil of useless NAS on dgex if dgex is willing to cooperate and send them to you, I will give them my command to do so.
I think we're good dude, but thanks for the offer!! (You didn't mention the coin you have ...)
Re: [ANN]ORA::NXT MS Currency::'Shuffling' for NXT::jl777 involved::Anon fungibility
what exactly is it you are complaining about?
it is clear, there is an AE for buying-selling in which we are not the real ones interested in ORA. It is not an AE that it represents to the community ORA.
Those that they have supported his NOW are those that they have not wanted to send his ORA for the change for XOR, nevertheless now beneficiaries go out on having had freedom with his ORA and having sold them if this way they decide it.
An important reporting has done with the most important part of the community caught in the account NXT-G7QA-2KUA-BLLZ-5FUCY
In my opinion, if there was an important reporting, the problem of the shareholders should be had solved first, to be on equal terms in the AE.
This AE does not represent to the community ORA
Meanwhile more raise the price in the AE, now it is in historical maxima, more unjust will be this situation for the shareholders.
Are you aware of the fact that there is a great deal of concern for the wellbeing of the person who collected the tokens?
Nobody knows what happened to DarkHorse, but obviously he didn't steal the pile of ORA tokens and bought a beach villa on Hawaii.
Since when a community depends on one person?
I've been in ORA since July / 14, do not rush, what I say is that the situation in the AE is not fair to the Shareholders.
If the price was stable there would be no problem but I just now rising to absolute maximum.
@josegines, thanks for following ORA and having your say, we need as many people involved and sharing their opinions as possible, and I understand your point, and I feel your frustration (I'm in the same situation as you, ORA locked up in DH's redemption account). While there does appear to be some trade 'action' happening now on the NXT AE that you're missing out on, maybe consider that the price is rising, so if you sold now you would miss out on 'potential' gains far exceeding what we've seen so far. Everything is uncertain of course, but ORA has never had better prospects than now with the 'ORA::Shuffling' idea. Maybe one day in the future you will be thankful that your ORA was locked up and you couldn't sell. I've talked to guys who sold all their bitcoins for $3 and thought at the time they made a great profit.
As for your comment "Since when a community depends on one person?", I would honestly say the vast majority of crypto projects suffer from this problem. We like to think of crypto as being 'decentralised' because the tech is based on the revolution of the blockchain, but the reality is the 'human dimension' of crypto is still very centralised around "key people". What would happen to emunie if Fuserleer went MIA, or to Ethereum if Vitalek dropped out. Truth is most crypto projects on the human level are pyramid shaped. There are exceptions (bitcoin & NXT), but for most alt coins there are key people keeping projects moving forward, and if they drop out too early, everything can fall apart rapidly.
Now, with ORA we've tried to recognize these realities from day one and we've tried to make ORA leaderless and 'starfish' like from the get-go, but in the case of DH and his treasury account I'm not sure if we could have done anything better. Soon NXT tech will allow for rock-solid mulit-user accounts with 2 of 3 access (i.e. one rogue treasurer can't take off with community money, but 2 of 3 treasurers can still access the funds in case one guy disappears).
The problem for ORA so far is that tech isn't available yet. Should DH have given me his account password? In retrospect maybe, but what if I lost it, or I got "hacked" (which I did in January!!). Then everyone would have been critical of poor community fund security practices. Remember poor klee and the NXT community funds being stolen from his account. Also, having me separate from the community funds was always essential to develop 'trust', and for a while there ORA was really two active guys (DH & myself), plus support guys offering ideas and feedback.
Anyway, I understand your frustration, but I'm a 'glass is half full' guy, and a couple of weeks ago I was putting ORA into stasis (i.e.effectively the project was over), then the HUMAN ELEMENT of ORA - the 'starfish' stuff - kicked in:
1- Pilot offered to be a community treasurer
2- Jack Needles suggested ORA as default NXT shuffle coin
3- jl777 got "interested" and offered to help us
That makes me conclude that despite the obvious problem with our chief treasurer going missing (who I'm personally very worried about as someone I worked with and got to know as a very good colleague & friend), ORA as a leaderless decentralized 'starfish' project is actually really healthy. I have contributed very little to this re-birth (not the idea, not the tech etc), and that makes me feel great. Remember, ORA started out as a community based 'experiment', so this really is about 'the journey'. There's no script (ORA development is 100% organic & community driven), so there's no 'guru' or tech messiah in the wings ready to do everything (or anything) unless they feel its worth the effort.
@josegines, you're just as much a 'leader' of ORA as me, so have your say on what you think *could/should* be done. You mentioned maybe 'we' should have organised everything behind the scenes, then made an announcement after the new treasury accounts and distribution were done, so as not to be unfair, and I understand that point. But that assumes too much pre-planning for a truly decentralized starfish organisation. There isn't a board room , or cabinet table where decisions get made, then announced. Everything has to be as open as possible, otherwise its not a decentralized leaderless process.