Just wanted to say that http://us.altmine.net:8652/ has been a great p2p pool for me so far.

It's like someone said, your payments start slow, and in small increments, as you mine they increase.  At first I was disappointed with my take and thinking that it was not adding up, I did not panic, I let it play out and sure enough the post about the payments increasing as you mine was true.  Getting some nice returns.

For anyone interested.   In less then 20 hours(19h40m) I have received 290 of these coins using 5 270x.  I am not sure if this is right for this coin, but it seems reasonable to me based on my original calculations. 

It was also stated that the payments continue for a bit after I stop mining, so the take may be much better.

None of you guys have mentioned a price.  IF the opportunity cost is lower then pointing at my usual pool, I may buy it.  

Seems to be the fairest X11 out there.   

I am contributing to a public discussion.  I did not even notice your user name, I am simply replying to an above post, which I see is addressed to the entire forum and not a PM.
 
My apologies if it caused you grief.

Your electricity is in your bitcoin.  It doesn't evaporate.  


Gridseed does not solve the issue, by charging you $200 bucks or more above and beyond for the same KH/s.   That $200 premium can not be cashed out with bitcoin.   You need to wait, and let the system pay itself off, that will take a while.  (i know in the long run its smarter/ but there is a curve where the two lines intersect, and at this price point, that intersection is far far away)



Also like I said in the previous message, there are technologies that will help you get that power cheaper then what your power company is charging you.   You did not have to wait for gridseed to employ those, if you are mining smartly, you are thinking of reducing your costs on both ends, and power generation is one of them.   If I can pay off a turbine or some panels with this tech, than I am gaining an asset from mining indirectly.   Also, I use the heat of my miners in the winter to heat my greenhouse.  So I make money that way as well.

It's not the power that is the problem with the gridseed, they got that sorted out, its the price.


Instead of the power company juicing you, you get to pay up front to gridseed (AMD:180/450=40 cents a Kh, vs gridseed .$1 or 60cents, if buy in bulk like the user above).


The thing about paying for power, is that you get to keep your power in bitcoins.  Hence, if my power usage of running my cards is 25%, that does not disappear, its stored in my bitcoins.  Rather then me buying bitcoins at the exchange, I buy power from the power company and make my own currency.   So in the future, I can salvage my power bill because ALL power used is sitting in my bitcoin.

 

The above example, starts to diminish with gridseed, but because of the steep up front costs, thats not going to happen for a long long time.


Also, those of us who have invested in renewable energy, are not selling it back to the grid at the bulk rate, we sell it at the going rate and get it in bitcoin. (think about that)


Believe it or not the technology to lower your power costs was out before bitcoin/gridseed, both of these strategies have to be employed by those mining for truly effective returns.  Get solar panels, get wind turbines, let your mining pay those technologies off.

Honestly, I can make PC's, for family and friends and get 80% of my money.  I like having the extra boards, I bought good chips knowing I would resell them later.  I did not just get something adequate for the job at hand.

I can fold my setup right now for close to 95% of my cost,  if these cards tumble in value, they only represent 80% of the hardware investment, so if they half, I still am looking at 60% and that is the worst possible outcome I can think of.  


As for the grid miner, I am fairly sure no one I know will need one once its of no value to me.  

So far it still does not look like this company can beat AMD.   Their $300 offering is only able to do 330kh/s, the power consumption is nice, but at the price, it will take a long time to even out with a $180 at 450kh/s.

All this hype and this unit still does not seem to compete with the current GPU's, and don't forget that AMD and NVIDIA have new ones in the works as well.


I also like the fact that I can spin off the hardware and make computers for family and friends if all this fails.   Not sure what I will be able to do with a gridminer.

Thanks for the info.  Looking at them right now.  

$1Kh, that's a very steep price.   I imagine competition will erode that eventually.

If the user who is running 32 of these is only getting 10Mh that means their performance leans towards the lower end of the scale.  Warranty is only for 30 days, I wonder what the life is of the chip.



With this sort of pricing, I would not be throwing out the GPU just yet.   I keep hearing how these things are going to murder the game, but the above offering doesn't even compete with current GPUs.  (which will hold partial value even when mining is dead)

Is he mining scrypt with them?  

I know there are units for Bitcoin, I just have not heard ones that do scrypt. 

Please post it, I would like to actually see one.

I was under the impression this is only being done with non-scrypt coins.

That is awesome if that is the case, but, I still am a bit skeptical.   Pre-orders are good way to get to play with people's money.  There is every reason for a company to be less than truthful, or embellish their offering in order to secure that pie.

How much heat does the chip generate at that performance level, how long can it sustain it, how much cooling do you need.   A raw MH/s doesn't mean much, it could be a peak, it could be what they got in a short time span.   What is the life of that chip when it runs that hard, etc...   These are all things AMD and NVIDIA have to deal with, before they shoot their mouths off. 

I also have a feeling these things will be DOA when they are given to the customer, I don't mean they won't function, but I think the manufacturer will weigh the profit/loss ratio of when to give you your miner.   We will see them on the network long before a singe pre-order is filled.  

I don't know about the low costs of running things.  Right now 1Mh required 300 watts.  I have heard that power is the barrier in producing these ASIC's that can mine scrypt.  AMD and NVIDIA have been spending millions in R&D to get these chips to be more efficient.  Heard that even at 20nanos these things still suck power.  They would love to omit those power connectors and keep you from needing to upgrade your power supply.   I can't see how some fly by night is going to beat AMD and NVIDIA on R&D.
 

The one offering I am hearing about is the Titan, its clearly stated that the miner can be pre-ordered without a Power Supply.  You should ask yourself, why a $10,000 miner is lacking a powersupply.   Perhaps the requirements are going to be steep.  Lets say 100Mh, is cut down to 150watts per 1Mh, which blows away the big boys like AMD and NVIDIA by 100%,  that still requires a 15,000 watt power supply.   What these preorders don't tell you is that you may need to spend another 10 grand on the powersupply unit, and maybe even require 3 phase power to run your miner.


So far, there is not even a jpeg of one of these units, and I sure have not seen the specs of how much power one of these Titans will suck, and that is as much of a consideration as the 10K pre-order price.

I honestly don't think crap coins are ready for ASIC, this isn't bitcoin, most people are middle mining them for something tangible.   Once ASIC comes on the scene it will just kill the coin.  Bitcoin had really good distribution when ASIC hit the network, the crap coins will die fast when ASIC miners come on the scene...   and I doubt they will be able to recoup their investment, the market will drop fast.   Right now its working because of the distribution, screw that up further and it will be a very dead horse.   

Sounds like a good time to use WireShark, or a good packet sniffer.


As for the dude that says its not worth it mining, I think you should start a facebook page and get others to join so you guys can sell your GPU's on ebay.  If you get enough miners onboard, our profits should go up quite a bit.   


I am all for OTHER people getting out of this gig.

.


You should be checking your rejection rate and hardware errors.  750khs means nothing if your card isn't properly tuned.  My rejection rate on steadyminer is  0.17%, much lower than the pools.

So far I have made 240K with 2200kh/s, and I have only been mining steadminer since 1am EST, so that is 13 hours worth of work.  Steady miner does not give rewards for finding blocks, instead the pile is divided evenly, so you do the math.

Lets put it this way, 1000kh/s should net you 200K, if you are consistently below that, mathematically speaking it means that you will need to have days when you are over the 200k limit, and so far no one has had those days on updamoon, even though the volume of miners is much larger there, and the take should be a lot closer to the calculated amount.


I know its been 2 days, but the dude needs to be booted before he kills the currency for the rest of us.  With that sort of Mh's rate he probably is sitting on the biggest pile.  


I know the developers want to be fair, but... they need to act quick on this and the suspicion of cheating should be enough.  The math isn't working out for anyone.  

EDIT:  If this is done quickly, it will speak volumes for the fairness of this coin.   We need to boot cheaters, or put them on suspension the  faster that is done the bigger chance this coin will have.

Thanks cryptohunter,

I gave the dude the benefit of the doubt, because I myself just started mining it yesterday, and wasn't going to stick my neck out, since I was not completely certain.

That said, I also was under the impression that it only came out on the 15th of this month.   ...but dude its your call, you can wait till it gets more difficult and an exchange adopts it, some of us are doing our part now to make sure that happens.

1 week, qualifies as just launched.

Also this coin has 1/4th the circulation of dodge.  There still plenty of them, and they can easily be used by emerging markets like India, China.   Dodge is great because you can charge 5 doges for a coffee in India, instead of .0000001BC or whatever, but the problem is that it is very prone to inflation because of the circulation.  This coin has the utility of Dodge and a much better cap.

It just launched, profitability is a risk,  those who mine it early may or may not get rewarded.


This is also true of ancient cultures who used sea shells as currency.   The first few people that picked them up on the beach were the money creators.  Naturally, it was easy pickings till all the shells on the beach were gone.  Then you had to go into the water, and as that was done, that got competitive too and you needed to go out further and further at greater resources and expense to yourself.  Sea shells are made with calcium and certain ones are scarce and take a long time to form.


So it's your call what you do.  In order for this coin to get anywhere it needs to be mined.