Quote from: FredericBastiat on August 13, 2012, 04:37:07 AM

Quote from: FirstAscent on August 13, 2012, 04:04:16 AM

What is the relevance of an ideology here? I'm saying (to you and myself), let's not discuss ideology. Instead, let's toss out ideologies, look at how things work, and discuss solutions. So what if I suggest regulation? I am not personally doing any regulating. What I am doing is trying to get others to at least know how things work before they render an ideology that solves the problem.

I don't have an interest in discussing application of an ideology (promoting mine, whatever it may be, or listening to others promoting their's) until we understand what the problems are. Even presupposing I'm as evil and control minded as you think, it's not relevant to the discussion. What is relevant is understanding the dynamics of the problem space. Why don't we focus on that?

For example, look at the title of this thread (which I did not create). Isn't it rather absurd, given that its goal is to make recommendations to those who actually take the time to study ecology, environmental science, biology and such from someone who is almost certainly far behind the curve within those fields? Isn't that kind of ridiculous? Before you answer, consider: it's not always healthy to do whatever you want, and especially when you're not fully informed on the ramifications of what you're doing.

I bolded some of the key words you used. The first is the word 'discuss'. Nothing wrong with that one. We can do that all day long and nobody gets hurt. The second word was 'regulation'. Despite the fact that you think that it's okay to regulate someone and their things, you rang the philosophical ideology bell (again). You've now just stepped back into the "ideology ring" and put your boxing gloves back on. You may not actually be the one "regulating", but you are complicit in its implementation if you agree with it. Say it ain't so.

If you aren't interested in discussing ideological implementations, why are you in this thread in the first place? Why not just start a science thread outside the 'politics and society' blog? Then you wouldn't get so confused and accosted by the likes of other "politically charged" characters such as myself.

And finally, and last but not least, you use the word 'healthy'. Healthy for who? Me? What if I want to be a big fat slob? Should you regulate what I eat? Make laws that increase the cost of specific foodstuffs you think might ruin my life.

Oh wait, that's not what you mean. Of course not, you're talking about the little creatures and plant life that live on my property. You want to make them healthier... So nice of you to care... Exactly how are you going to achieve that? How many times do I have to ask the same question over and over again? Are you going to sacrifice my life for a creature that roams my land (or hire others to do it for you)?

Because if you do, then I could just as easily consider you a creature too and hunt you like prey. If you stray onto my hunting ground that I've marked (I'm territorial), I might just have you for dinner. All's fair in prey and predator right? We're just a bunch of animals right? No right nor wrong, just food and apex predatory behaviour.

Try discussing, rather than forcing others to say things. It's kind of hypocritical, don't you think? Nobody is stopping you from discussing and sharing knowledge about how the environment works, are they? Instead, what you're doing is demanding that someone state a position on a solution that agrees with you before discussing the mechanics of the problem. Kind of backwards, isn't it?