Quote from: Nemo1024 on April 13, 2015, 03:49:02 PM

hofor also resorts to a logical fallacy in "Many of the claims are simply false, and anyone who bothered to look it up would see that they are false." referring to some unspecified claims that are allegedly false and not saying what is exactly false.

I did say exactly what is false. I was very specific, in fact.

I pointed out your false claim that an insignificant suspicion of mistreatment leads to the child being taken form its parents.

I pointed out your false claim that a child can be taken away for losing a milk tooth.

I pointed out your false claim that there are rules in Norway that children must always sleep in their own beds otherwise the child will be taken away.

I pointed out your false claim that there is "de-genderization" going on.

I pointed out your false claim that feeding a child from one's hand is considered force-feeding.

I also asked you for the sources of all these demonstrably false claims.

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Actually, hofor states that in direct opposition to all the evidence that's been collected in this thread and to the evidence/articles pointed to on related forums.

I'm sorry, but unfounded claims from individuals with a vested interest in cases is not evidence. When you make outrageous claims that are demonstrably false, that says a lot about your so-called "evidence" or rather the lack of it.

You are automatically and without a grain of critical thinking accepting claims of parents who have had their children taken away from them, and you are posting demonstrably false claims about rules and regulations in Norway.

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Now that we have this out of the way, let me reiterate some of the evidence, by asking three questions.

None of this is evidence. All of it is hearsay. There are no objective, verifiable sources.

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1. How would you classify an act of a country that detains a child with a foreign citizenship despite protests of this child's guardians and the childs home-country. Further this country provides shaky or no evidence to extradite this child to his home-country? In my book that's kidnapping/abduction. And that's exactly what happened in the case of the 3 Russian families, mentioned in the OP and in subsequent posts, as well as to Czech families, Polish families and the recent Lithuanian families, whose case hofor so viciously attacked.

Why are you assuming that the stories of these people are accurate, and that they are not simply lying or omitting inconvenient facts to further their own cause? How do you know that the CPS did not rightfully take the children away from abusive parents?

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2. What would you say face-to-face, to the father, who's daughters are held in captivity by the Norwegian state:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=828129.msg10752510#msg10752510

This is just another example of how you automatically assume that you are given an accurate description of the situation. How do you know that the parents did not abuse the children?

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3. How would you describe the following selection of official reasons, given in order to deprive parents of their children and children of their parents?
http://www.mhskanland.net/page10/page122/page122.html

I see no sources, and no evidence. Just a list of unsourced claims.

I do like this sentence from the page: "And why does anybody believe that 'child experts' who come up with that kind of argument even had it been only in a single case can be trusted in their 'diagnosing' of other cases?"

It is highly relevant, because we see a number of false claims from you and the owner of that site. No child will be taken away from its parents because there is no "military order" in the clothing cabinet. That's a preposterous claim. I also list several preposterous claims from you above. With all of these misleading and false claims, how can either of you be trusted to be factual and objective/unbiased when it comes to the CPS?

Now for my questions:

Do you really think one of the top countries on human rights would have an entire system in place just to terrorize innocent parents?

Do you really believe that a child was taken away from its parents because it lost a milk tooth?

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Finally, do read Marianne Skanland's posts, and keep an eye on the following sites
Save our children: http://forum.r-b-v.net/
English subsection: http://www.barnevern.org/category/utenlandske-nyheter/

Unfortunately, the quality of these sites is rather bad. Claims are appearing out of thin air and people on the forums are accepting them without a single critical thought. This is what a cult does.

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Quote from: hofor on April 12, 2015, 11:54:52 PM

As a thought experiment, let's consider a child who's being beaten and sexually abused by both of its parents. Should this child not be taken away from them?

I can answer this one. Yes.

Good. Now, please provide evidence that these cases you have mentioned are in fact not cases where the children have been mistreated.

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But that's not the majority of child extraction cases. What about the cases, when the child is a foreign citizen? Why should Norway so desperately hold onto a citizen of another country, breaking every thinkable international law?

Please cite some of these laws. Furthermore, please cite the relevant Norwegian laws. Because you are not just making assumptions with no real evidence, are you?

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What about the cases, where the child, after having been taken from his parents, is beaten and mistreated by the foster parents, but is return to those abusers even if he managers to escape?

There are cases of children being mistreated by foster parents, and that is of course completely unacceptable. As unacceptable as when the real parents mistreat a child. In both cases, the child should be taken away from them, do you not agree?

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Another case:
http://www.barnevern.org/aistei-ramoskienei-fra-litauen-mistet-sonnen-til-norske-barnevernet/
A Lithuanian woman lost her 5-yo child to Norwegian CPS, after she left her husband, who displayed violent attitude. I'll write an English translation of the article later.

And not a single critical thought and no critical questions asked. Every wild story about the evil CPS is accepted as Truth.