Quote from: WillyBTC on June 22, 2015, 12:27:03 AM

Quote from: Crestington on June 21, 2015, 11:53:14 PM

Quote from: WillyBTC on June 21, 2015, 10:38:25 PM

Quote from: suchmoon on June 21, 2015, 02:54:30 PM

Quote from: kken01 on June 21, 2015, 08:01:40 AM

its not trolling or fud when you are trying to understand the product. there were clear problems in the initial proposal. just because you want to invest & had good interactions with whocares doesnt translate into non questioning undying love from the larger community. trust is earned not demanded. also some people made money with GAW but it doesnt mean it was right

you have to separate people from ideas. ridiculing ideas is perfectly fine and should be done. no idea is perfect from the get go, it has to evolve to be a good one. the doctor might have good intentions but it needs real work. reason for extra scrutiny is due to the fact that some people from the HT community tried to regain their losses by starting ponzis and other scams (tntcoin and what not). to the doctors credit he didnt remove all posts from his thread and communicated in a way that could gain him trust and respect in the long run. role of the dev was left quite unclear. was he there to generate value for his other project, hired to just dev it or what. because they shared one account to post it turned very convoluted. transparency > *

ps:
garza told a terminally ill person to invest his nest egg after his initial investment into GAW. that guy lost his legacy due to the overall attitude of not asking questions. (to make it less sad one guy from the "original 19" gave him 10k to leave something behind for his wife)

Thank you, saved me typing my own response Grin

Bagholding is a very bad motivation, worse than the other big reason why people get into crypto (greed). A bagholder trying to recover his/her lost "investment" by cooking up another scheme is like a gambler who just lost a yolo bet and is borrowing money to win it all back. Would you lend money to such person?

All those post-XPY schemes should be considered more dangerous than any other shitcoin for that reason alone IMHO.

Quote

I do not disagree with what many of you have stated. I would like to respond to some of the replies. I did lose some on Paycoin and ignored the warning signs, big mistake but it wasn't much money. I bought an account because I think if I post with my real account I will be ridiculed for a mistake I made and do not wish to have my personal life brought into your thread.

In response to another couple of comments, yes I am aware of the guy with terminal cancer that Josh screwed. I cannot remember his name on HT but I think it started with the letter "T' and I believe he did some design work. I am also aware that you guys were on JG before the emails were leaked or made available and I apologized in a previous post, if I didn't then I apologize now.

His screen name was Trixster and was also active a bit on the GetHashing forums as well.

Quote

I was one of the guys that was on HT for a long time and saw many people come and go. I do know that many on the GAW thread have been ridiculed for trying to help those that did lose. Just because people have a desire to try and get a coin back on its feet and that coin was a HUGE scam by JG does not mean they are a scammer. I also see your points that it will be exceedingly difficult because it is a flawed coin to begin with.

This just comes back to doing the things that need to be done and helping in the most effective way and facing whatever people are going to say head on and make no apologies about it. If someone is going to try to embarrass you how are they going to succeed if you are open and upfront about the things that you are doing? Hack into your emails and release all your private information? What if everything in private is exactly the same things said in public?

Quote

I do see the point that it is definitely a riskier endeavor to invest in an HT members coin than someone that did not potentially lose money on Paycoin. Once again, you are assuming that Whocares lost money, when in reality it was stated on multiple threads by a lot of members that Whocares didn't even start on Paycoin until late in the game.

If Whocares does have good intentions and you have good intentions (preventing scams and protecting people), wouldn't it have been easier to contact him or another team member and say "listen, many of us have a problem with you coming out with a coin that resembles Paycoin, particularly since you were an active HT member. We strongly advise you to rethink the coin" or hell, maybe even add in a small incentive (aka threat) like "or we will haunt you down like that scumbag JG'

If you contact someone privately asking them if it's a scam and they tell you it isn't, then that will not make it a scam? What if you asked the wrong questions and the information provided was false but you believed it and then other people based their judgments on your personal analysis?

Quote

That at least gives an honest person something to consider and allows them to respond. I can tell you from my point of view, I am scared to death of you guys and want none of you crawling up my ass, not because I am scared of what you will find but because I do not want to deal with the embarassment that I have seen on the GAW thread because I made a dumb ass move.

You should never be scared to hide information because you are afraid of what other people might think or people would use that information to try to embarrass you. Information is only embarrassing if you deem it so, people pick up on this and jump on it, this is the internet and what people say about the things you do really does not matter in the slightest. Some of the best advice I was ever given was "to own your mistakes" because everyone is going to make mistakes, it's part of life but you cannot learn from your mistakes if you cannot face them, accept them and learn from them.

Quote

I am not here to promote anyone or anything accept to possibly enlighten a few people that a different approach from some of you could do a lot of good for crypto and BCT. There is so much hate and trolling that it makes it impossible for someone that may have a good idea to foster that idea. I am not saying that scammers should get off easy or that 90+% of coins aren't scams.

Like I have said before, it is very obvious that many of you know crypto very well, I just think that your talents could also be used to benefit crypto in a positive way.

I pissed off Whocares/kilo17 on the Bitstone thread for making this thread because he said it was uncalled for and very inflammatory. So again I want to apologize for the OP. I have invited him to post here on the thread for what I think could be potentially invaluable feedback.

"Hate and trolling" is the reality on the internet and if you cannot accept that and discuss the issues that people have a problem with in a mature manner then you should not be doing this kind of work. Face life head on, you will always come out ahead because if you are not then those things will build up until they get out of control.

You are saying that Whocares/kilo17 are angry because you are discussing these things, I see that as a red flag for investing in their project since they should be the ones answering peoples questions.

Valid points to debate. I think the dialog we are having is helping me understand for sure. While I do agree with you on most of your points, consider this: the first post on the BitStone thread were a link to an unmoderated thread- which I am not saying in and of itself was wrong, I am saying that in that thread it was nothing but a bunch of personal attacks and posts that were copied from the GAW thread. Those types of comments have no value to a coin release and most if not all were simply FUD.

Secondly, I do think the first posts from several of the GAW thread regulars on the BitStone thread were scam accusations and offered no real reasoning. Some of the posts after that had VERY valid points, no doubt. The problem in my eyes is this, if a person comes on a thread and the first post is SCAM then all post after that are soured. Having said that, it is exactly what I did on this thread and I appreciate you continuing to discuss matters with me.

Lastly, I apparently did not make myself clear. Kilo17 was angry at me for the OP (meaning the original post I made) - which most of you were also upset about.

I do appreciate your replies.

Anyone serious about investing is going to wade through the FUD and decide for themselves based heavily on how those questions are answered, if they provide no real reasoning then people would see that as well. I looked through the thread and also saw that instead of attempting to answer these questions that the conversation was shifted into deflection mode. Regardless of FUD or not, the questions people were asking were never answered and talking about the tactics used in ascertaining the truth still does not make the project any more legitimate or plausible.