Quote from: BFL_Josh on September 11, 2012, 06:40:56 AM

...
But I am, once again, trying to reach out and mend fences but you keep throwing it back in my/BFL's face.

Kissing ass has never been on my agenda. However, what is on my agenda is a) not blind hatred far exceeding the cause and b) an complete disregard for the fact that I have been trying to make changes for the better with regards to community relations and yes developers are part of that community.

With regards to our discussion, you made a blanket statement that we "needed" (as in, it was a requirement to have mining software and that there was none since no developer would work on it) and I corrected you that we have EasyMiner, so that statement was not true. Would we like to have cgminer support? Sure, but is it required? No, our devices will mine just fine without it. So nothing has changed since that, we are still in the same position. We have the backing of basically all the popular miners except (apparently) cgminer... that being the case, why would we want to support a miner that doesn't want to support us? This is not really a rhetorical question, because I would like to hear your answer to this. For the record, we planned on supporting you/cgminer anyway regardless of what you respond with, but I would like to hear why you think we should support someone who clearly does not want to support us and has only begrudgingly done so up to this point?

Because I read what you say ...

You are saying that "need" is something I am inventing, but you know as well as I do that without the support of the free miners, BFL would not be where they are today.
If you think otherwise, then this discussion will get nowhere - coz I certainly do not agree with that.

"We have the backing of basically all the popular miners except (apparently) cgminer"
This is such a one sided and ridiculous statement it's not funny.
It blatantly pushes in everyone's face one of the biggest issues I have with the whole BFL <-> miner development relationship.
However, I have never said that other developers would not work on software for you.
I've not even said cgminer wouldn't - ckolivas' controls the project, not me.
If he wants to add anything, he can do so as he pleases.
If he doesn't want some of my code - he can reject it as he pleases.
I do know some of his discussion with BFL on this exact subject ...
I do ask you to explain why you think miner software developers should work on software for your devices for free?
You are directly implying that yet again in that statement, and the ONLY change to that is a comment by you today - never in the past from BFL.

What Tom has done, is up front clearly state support for some developers, (myself included) and then the next day you make an attempt to mend the issue and try to make it sound like it's got nothing to do with BFL - it's my fault Tongue

Up to this point I have DEFINITELY begrudgingly supported BFL since they have done NOTHING for me except profit from the person who bought a BFL from them and then that person sold it to me at their cost price + shipping to me ... and got it to me in 4.5 days when BFL would have taken at least 10 weeks back then.
Hell - I even put BFL support in the cgminer API before I even had a BFL device - why? - for completeness (maybe someone gave me some BTC to do it? I can't remember?) - and certainly not in any way for BFL's sake - only for the sake of those users who use cgminer.
Why would I do it for BFL's sake?
Why would I spend my time for free to do something to help BFL make more profits and I gain nothing at all from it?
(OK I do actually do that in IRC and on the forum, but I guess that's my own choice to waste my time doing that)

It may no longer be that today, but it was certainly correct in my opinion before today.

I don't see at all why you think I should have gone out of my way to do more than that?
There was absolutely no reason - all I saw up until today is BFL saying: sux to be you developers, work for us for free, that is to BFL's advantage - but we even say we don't "need" you to do that so it doesn't make us look bad expecting you to do it for free.

Even saying "Oh we didn't have any hardware to supply developers" is bullshit.
What it really means is "We didn't allocate any hardware for that coz we didn't think it was needed and we could get it for free anyway"
And you will not be able to convince me that I am wrong with my judgment on that statement.
Tell me how each part of that statement was wrong?

I do not think you must support me.
You haven't. Even if I have already done the reverse begrudgingly or indirectly ...
I simply say that if you want developer support you should support the developers.
If you did provide support to me for BFL ASIC devices then I would probably supply support in return - or reject the offer of support from you ...
(and I will point out that I do that in real life - I often make decisions NOT based on profit - I don't consider money a commodity worth caring too much about - even though I have very little - which is probably due to that also Tongue

)