Quote from: americanpegasus on October 29, 2015, 12:57:30 AM

if I were the sole developer of a coin I could announce that I quit shortly before shorting the coin - I would obviously make money (for example if this John Conner person shorted his VanillaCoin).

I wasn't aware he quit. The less I am aware of, the more I must be programming and not foruming. So I hope to become more unaware. Ah so good that VNL fanboiz will hopefully not try to get revenge on me now for my prior critical peer review on Conner's white paper.

Quote from: americanpegasus on October 29, 2015, 12:57:30 AM

Quote

I suggest you review the thread I did on investment securities. I don't think UNREGISTERED disclosure protects you from creating an implicit investment contract with prospective investors for an UNREGISTERED investment security.

Please link it; I can't seem to find it.

Linked in up thread post:

Quote from: TPTB_need_war on October 28, 2015, 06:35:56 PM

I do want to warn you that by pumping the expectation of gains (your firm statement there are only buyers and no sellers) thus creating an implied investment contract under the law as I interpret it, I do believe you are converting this coin into an unregistered investment security.

Quote from: americanpegasus on October 29, 2015, 12:57:30 AM

As well, there's no way to register ownership of any of these assets at the moment because they are in a quasi-legal status.

Perhaps you should speak with an attorney. You appear to make irrelevant assumptions that appear to me to be invalid based on my limited reading the USA securities law. Consider to review the thread I linked to (and to the main thread it links to over in the Bitcoin Discussion forum). Maybe I am just being a loud-mouthed fool, but perhaps take some time to understand what I think I am reading in the law. Again I don't write that to be putting any one down. The law doesn't seem to say what you are apparently thinking it does about what you think is quasi-legal.

Quote from: americanpegasus on October 29, 2015, 12:57:30 AM

I suppose they would technically float between being defined as a commodity (gold) or a currency (dollars). Does the SEC regulate the gold market? I don't think so. If I owned 1% of all gold in the world, and was online singing the praises of gold, would that be against the law? If I owned 1% of all Romanian currency, and I was singing what an economic resurgence that Romania was about to have - would I be in violation of any law?

Again I think the classification of Bitcoin as a commodity or what ever (from a tax standpoint) has nothing to do with the fact that these are shares from the perspective of securities law and if they are promoted to investors then they become securities backed by the expectations created by the promoter. Please go read the law.

Quote from: americanpegasus on October 29, 2015, 12:57:30 AM

It's important to remember that unless new legislation is passed in the US, these are commodities.

For taxes. That is a different aspect of the law. Securities Act looks at crypto as shares depending on several factors.

We can probably argue that Bitcoin is already a phenomenon that can't be backed by a promoter selling Bitcoin shares, thus Bitcoin is probably not a security in the eyes of USA securities law. But the smaller altcoins are much more precariously close if not already securities.

Quote from: americanpegasus on October 29, 2015, 12:57:30 AM

So no one has to worry about violating a securities law just because they are speculating on a commodity.

Let's see what you think after reading the law on securities.

Quote from: americanpegasus on October 29, 2015, 12:57:30 AM

(even in the case of actual securities, the internet is filled with message boards where people are free to speculate about their future prices - and do).

Of registered securities, or of prices of things where they can't possibly drive the price and give reasonable expectations that their promotions and representations are a form backing for the future expectations of those investors reading. I didn't state so eloquently. Better to read the law that I quoted in the linked thread.

Afaik, you have a very important role in XMR and Aeon, so your representations could perhaps be construed by investors to be a force of actual future events and thus future gains. Afaics, this totally changes the way you are viewed under Securities Act and the SEC vs. Howey decision.

Quote from: americanpegasus on October 29, 2015, 12:57:30 AM

http://www.wired.com/2014/12/finney-swat/

Buy a gun. Then buy another. If/once your worth exceeds 8-figures in USD, hire actual security. If your net worth exceeds 9-figures in USD, hire the best security money can buy.

Sobering. Thanks.