Quote from: Anonymous on September 22, 2010, 01:53:52 AM

Quote from: thrashaholic on September 20, 2010, 06:03:46 PM

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While you can connect to the bitcoin network they are currency. If Mt Gox created his own different token system that stopped you from cashing out immediately it would be a virtual currency. The other difference is that Mt Gox would then own this virtual currency,not the person who deposited it. When you buy into a virtual currency it becomes the property of the company.

According to what, though? According to the Mt Gox TOS? What if the TOS said the explicit opposite? Is there case law already regarding this?

Is not the bitcoin casino, in effect, using bitcoin as in-game currency already? If not, what's the differentiating factor?

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You are missing the point that virtual currencies are proprietary therefore a bitcoin implementation within a private company would also need to be proprietary. If it is ever used on facebook dont expect it to be used anywhere else by any competitor.

I don't follow the logic here. It doesn't absolutely have to be the case, just because it is usually the case. Just because some company says so in their TOS doesn't make it true in every instance, and it doesn't make it true that every company would desire to create their own proprietary virtual currency.

So are you saying if you sign a voluntary contract ie a TOS you can break it because you think it should say something else? If you use someones property you need to respect the rules they have. Unless you dont believe in property rights.....

I suggest you find companies that support what you are trying to achieve rather than barging into breaking contracts you sign. I believe in persuasion rather than conflict which is going to come up sooner or later if you ignore what their TOS says. Has anyone even contacted these companies to see if they would support using bitcoin or are you intent on just "hoping" they dont notice ? If they refuse to do so what are you going to do about it?

Whoa whoa whoa, wtf are you talking about? Nobody's talking about breaking contracts here, dude, chill out. I'm talking about someone creating their OWN game on their OWN servers, with their OWN TOS - NOT someone creating a game on Facebook. Facebook, or any other company's TOS, means exactly dick to me. Eff Facebook. I suggest you reread my questions, slowly and carefully, before you start throwing "contract breaker!" around, or suggesting that I don't respect property rights - which frankly is laughable. You answered my first, very direct, questions with a simple "Look at Facebook's TOS" which didn't answer anything, nor did it have any applicability to my questions. You're still stuck on this - maybe you think that all games anyone could ever want to create would be FB games. Whatever your misunderstanding there is, you need to seriously examine your assumptions, and step down off of your soapbox.

Regarding your very fallacious statements: any solid answers to my questions?

Here, I'll rephrase the main one so you couldn't possibly misconstrue:

If I form a company, create my own game, write my own TOS that is carefully worded, and allow people to deposit, use, and withdraw bitcoins (just like MtGox, the Casino, etc...) what is LEGALLY stopping me from doing that? As far as I can tell - nothing. That's what I'm asking. Are there specific statutes or case law in effect? The way some other company, whomever they may be, does it is completely moot to me. The technical aspects of doing this are beyond the scope of my question. The IRC conversation focused on one very narrow segment of gaming and I do not believe the issues raised within apply to all games or ideas.

Second, very simple, very direct question:
Is the bitcoin casino (and MtGox in a way) not, in effect, using bitcoin as an in-game currency. If not, why?

The other questions I raised were merely me questioning your faulty logic, statements, and assumptions. All Virtual Currencies are Proprietary is a fallacy as is everything based on that assumption that follows. All TOS Contracts Limit Ownership is as well; just because it is so for every example you can find does not make it absolutely true.

If you can't answer my questions, or don't understand them, maybe you shouldn't respond like you're some authority on the subject; especially not in an underhanded manner.