Sorry for the long reply but I was away for a few days.
Part 1:
Say what? Necessary?!?
God made the rules... he didn't have to make it necessary if he didn't want to... why murder your own son?
God could have waved his magic wand and forgiven sin without any need for bloodshed... necessary? ha!
God sacrifices himself, to himself, to serve as a loophole for a rule he created himself... seems legit...
Exactly. It is said that God knew everything from the beginning. Then why does he allow all this pain and suffering in the world? To
prove a point?
You could ask the same question about 'the flood'...
If God knew he was going to kill 99.999% of the population... why create them in the first place? Why not just start with Noah instead
of Adam? Why kill 99.999% of the population for being evil?...
God created them, knowing they were going to turn out evil... wtf? Now he sent 99.999% of the planet to hell for no reason... why
create any soul that is destined to hell?
That sounds mean to me, creating a soul that you plan to torture for eternity... why would a "God" do that?
This is the main problem with religion... none of the events make a bit of sense when you apply critical thinking skills...
I have to completely agree with Moloch: why would God, who has all His attributes to the superlative: amongst them being "all-knowing",
create a world, only to destroy it later because the beings that He created after a time got bad/evil? Isn't He "all-powerful"? So if
He knows everything what happened? Bad coding? System error? He doesn't make mystakes! He's perfect in all ways!
So, as Moloch said: why the flood? Is it sadism?
Also: sending all the bad souls to hell: for ETERNITY! Because they weren't perfect! Because they were created like that: imperfect.
Moloch, and all of us are trying to use pure reason. I say "trying" because us too are not perfect. Why are you against reason? Against
things that make sense?
I don't know about all atheists but if you leave me alone I'll leave you alone - be contempt in your made up world, it's ok. But stop
trying to convince us about God's existence!
Anyone who compares the opposition to Hitler, automatically loses any argument they tried to make.
Hitler didn't kill any(?) Jews himself, other Germans did that... and guess what... those Germans were mostly Christian, same as
America!... that means Christians did all that evil murdering... get your facts right...
Religion is the force responsible for the vast majority of wars throughout history. Christians are solely responsible for what we
commonly refer to as "The Dark Ages"... 300 years of crusades, and inquisition!
Just read the bible... how many nations did the Jews attack? "The Promised Land", "The land of milk and honey", was such because there
were people living on that land... they were farmers and bee-keepers, which is why they had milk and honey... until the Jews killed
them all and took their milk and honey... that's how religion operates... they kill and take people's stuff... all the while claiming
moral authority directly from God Himself!
Again: if Christians are so good why have so many people died in the name of God? Something's wrong here, I tell you.
Say what? Necessary?!?
God made the rules... he didn't have to make it necessary if he didn't want to... why murder your own son?
God could have waved his magic wand and forgiven sin without any need for bloodshed... necessary? ha!
God sacrifices himself, to himself, to serve as a loophole for a rule he created himself... seems legit...
Exactly. It is said that God knew everything from the beginning. Then why does he allow all this pain and suffering in the world? To
prove a point?
You could ask the same question about 'the flood'...
If God knew he was going to kill 99.999% of the population... why create them in the first place? Why not just start with Noah instead
of Adam? Why kill 99.999% of the population for being evil?...
God created them, knowing they were going to turn out evil... wtf? Now he sent 99.999% of the planet to hell for no reason... why
create any soul that is destined to hell?
That sounds mean to me, creating a soul that you plan to torture for eternity... why would a "God" do that?
This is the main problem with religion... none of the events make a bit of sense when you apply critical thinking skills...
You forget one thing. God loved us so much, that He did the best for us. What is that best? God is giving us in our selves, Himself. He
is making us like Him. We have the choice to be like Him or not. How do we have that choice? He gave it to us. Either join Him and be
like Him, or do away with ourselves.
What's the question here? I'd slap you ion the face if I was God. And to think He offers you the greatest thing that there is... to be
like Him. And you even suggest turning it down. What an insult. Even you would be insulted if you offered someone a million dollars,
and besides not accepting it, all he did was to call you a piece of shit to your face.
His best? There is no "best" for Him. He's perfect, no? All encompassing.
Also: God is three persons: God is God, Jesus is God, the holy spirit is God. Three persons, one being. Then God killed Himself? Also:
if He killed Himself knowing that He would not really die what does that prove? Who wouldn't die without a problem if he/she would have
the certainty that after three days he/she would be again alive without a scratch?
There are certainly better Moloch quotes... Allen Ginsberg did an amazing job:
Howl by Allen Ginsberg : The Poetry Foundation
I believe Allen Ginsberg's Moloch was influenced by the 1927 film,
'Metropolis'
Why are you using this name?
Best regards.
He uses his name because he chose to. Jeez. All the questions.
Why am I not surprised that the "Christian" is the one talking about assaulting the non-Christian? Kinda proving my point about
religion being the aggressor, dontcha think?
Let's say hypothetically, I'm wrong... God exists, he's the Christian God, etc... Would I worship him? FUCK NO!!! The God of
the bible is an evil bastard... I've read the bible... I would never love or worship that God even if the entire bible were 100%
true...
For more info, I'll refer you to Stephen Fry, because he does an amazing job explaining this point:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI
There are so many inconsistencies in the Bible, so many contradictions. I could name 100 without breaking a sweat! With verses to
prove what I say.
Anyone who compares the opposition to Hitler, automatically loses any argument they tried to make.
Hitler didn't kill any(?) Jews himself, other Germans did that... and guess what... those Germans were mostly Christian, same as
America!... that means Christians did all that evil murdering... get your facts right...
Religion is the force responsible for the vast majority of wars throughout history. Christians are solely responsible for what we
commonly refer to as "The Dark Ages"... 300 years of crusades, and inquisition!
Just read the bible... how many nations did the Jews attack? "The Promised Land", "The land of milk and honey", was such because there
were people living on that land... they were farmers and bee-keepers, which is why they had milk and honey... until the Jews killed
them all and took their milk and honey... that's how religion operates... they kill and take people's stuff... all the while claiming
moral authority directly from God Himself!
You play with semantic-like ideas.
In addition, the Jews who attacked and killed people who didn't believe in God, were doing those people a favor. Here's how.
God is just. He will punish wicked people according to the quantity and quality of their wickedness.
Now imagine as an example that you were 20 years old, and had been wicked all your life. By the time you were, say, 50, wouldn't you
have done a whole lot more wickedness? If you die at 50, you have a lot more to be punished for in Hell than you would have if you died
at 20.
So, here you are, 20, and out fighting the Jews in battle. You die in battle. You have a lot less to pay for in Hell than if you died
at 50, peacefully. The Jews have done you a favor by killing you.
If you had wanted to convert to God and be with the Jews, you could have left your family and the war, and have waited for peaceful
times to contact the Jews to convert. They would have let you.
Here you are right now, fighting against God. And death in youthfulness might even be gone for you, so that you don't build up a larger
amount of wickedness to be punished for in Hell. Turn to God so that He can wipe your wickedness away, so that you don't have to pay
for it in Hell. Such is a free gift from God, if you turn to Him.
Your choice, of course. God holds it open for you until the time of your death. Do you know when that will happen, exactly... the day
of your death, I mean?
Semantic ideas?! Atheists deal with facts! Theologians play with words and semantics, twisting everything until you're dizzy and agree
either because you're tired or all the twistings have "convinced" you. Until you're converted. Then they're (the Christians) happy.
Because that's their agenda. To convert you. They can't be happy alone. Everyone must be like them! They have the absolute truth.
Killing people that don't believe in God is doing them a favor?! Jeez dude! Isn't "thou shall not kill" one of the most sacred of the
ten commandments?! Dying quicker in life is better? That's the most stupid psychologism I've ever heard. Let me quote the man again:
"What have you been smoking dude?".
Also: you have less to pay if you die younger? Isn't hell forever? I mean if you die at 20 you only stay in hell forever instead of
"forever" if you die at 50... How about if I live until 100 and live a rational life without war, religion and other non-sense? And
dedicate my life to art and reason and science?
Fighting against God? He's all powerful. Don't tell me He's affraid. I mean it's enough just to blink and all His enemies would simply
wanish, right? What fighting? People are fighting because He allow it.
So after you die all is lost? You can't repent after death? What's with the rules? If it's true and sincere why not? The rules can't
changed? I mean, again, He is all powerful.
Why am I not surprised that the "Christian" is the one talking about assaulting the non-Christian? Kinda proving my point about
religion being the aggressor, dontcha think?
Let's say hypothetically, I'm wrong... God exists, he's the Christian God, etc... Would I worship him? FUCK NO!!! The God of
the bible is an evil bastard... I've read the bible... I would never love or worship that God even if the entire bible were 100%
true...
For more info, I'll refer you to Stephen Fry, because he does an amazing job explaining this exact point:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI
"The fear of the Lord is the instruction of wisdom; and before honour is humility."
- Pro 15:33
"By humility and the fear of the Lord are riches, and honour, and life."
- Pro 22:4
Don't you like Wisdom and Science?
Best regards.
From what I see Wisdom and Science are exactly what he talks about. What we all are trying to promote.
Why am I not surprised that the "Christian" is the one talking about assaulting the non-Christian? Kinda proving my point about
religion being the aggressor, dontcha think?
Let's say hypothetically, I'm wrong... God exists, he's the Christian God, etc... Would I worship him? FUCK NO!!! The God of
the bible is an evil bastard... I've read the bible... I would never love or worship that God even if the entire bible were 100%
true...
For more info, I'll refer you to Stephen Fry, because he does an amazing job explaining this point:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI
You completely miss the point. You dare to insult God while He is holding your life in His hands. Wouldn't you crush a bug who insulted
you while you were trying to keep it alive? And hearing this, you don't stop, even though God in His mercy waits for you to change. How
long does He have to wait?
If we are so small in front of God why would He be insulted? I don't get insulted if a dog barks at me on the street.
God created Man to adore Him and then when that doesn't happen we are threaten with hell. That's arrogance.
That's not selflessness. We should have been created to be happy not to adore Him so that He can feel better about Himself.
Also, you are phrasing that incorrectly... "God is just" implies that justice exists without God... It's like saying, "God is good"...
well... that's not what you believe... you believe, "Good is God"... whatever God does is just/good, not because the act itself is
good, but because anything God does is exempt... If God decides to murder innocent Egyptian children and animals by the tens of
thousands, its just/good because God did the murdering of innocent children (see the 10th plague of Egypt)
You believe that whatever God does is just/good, not because murder is just/good, but because when God does it, he's special and
exempt...
Why do you assume that someone who doesn't believe in God is wicked/evil? Are all atheists wicked in your eyes? What about Muslims,
Hindu, Buddhist? All evil too?
Just because someone doesn't believe in Santa without evidence, does not make them evil... it makes them less gullible than you...
Right again.
God says it Himself in the bible.
better.
Why do you assume that someone who doesn't believe in God is wicked/evil? Are all atheists wicked in your eyes? What about Muslims,
Hindu, Buddhist? All evil too?
Just because someone doesn't believe in Santa without evidence, does not make them evil... it makes them less gullible than you...
Everyone who does not believe in God is wicked and evil. Why? Because one of the greatest things God made us for is to praise and
worship Him. If a person doesn't believe in God, any praise of God he does will only be incidental. He is not allowing himself to do
the thing that God made him for. This is wickedness... very great evil.
God didn't make people to go to Hell. When people in their stupidity and ignorance opted for the Hell route, God left a way open for
them to be saved. And this way wasn't only with the idea of simple salvation. It is designed to give people some of the glory of
Jesus... to be like God. And you want to throw it away.
God doesn't say anything in the Bible. God did not write the Bible. Men did.
"Everyone who does not believe in God is wicked and evil." Jeez dude! I don't like to call people stupid because I wouldn't like to be
called like that but you're asking for it. God gave us free will. So we're using it. If He wanted mindless drones He should have
created that! He gives us free will and then when we exercise it He gets upset? That's not right.
So He created us to worship Him and He did us a favor? Are you really that brainwashed? I mean, you do realize that makes no sense
right?
I can quote the bible too:
"If a man sells his daughter as a servant, she is not to go free as male servants do. If she does not please the master who has
selected her for himself, he must let her be redeemed. He has no right to sell her to foreigners, because he has broken faith with
her." Exodus 21:7
"Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be
punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property." Exodus 21:20
"If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his
wife." Exodus 22:16
(This is a great law for any rapist who wants to marry his rape victim... not so fun for the woman who is required to marry her rapist)
"Whoever sacrifices to any god other than the Lord must be destroyed" Exodus 22:20
(better start killing those other religions... God commands you to!)
"Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a
man." Numbers 31:17-18
(kill all the men, but keep the virgins as your property... now that's a plan!)
Can you answer questions?
Best regards.
No answers needed. Those verses speak for themselves. And actually he did answer, in between the parantheses under the verses.
God says it Himself in the bible.
God didn't write the bible, Christians stopped believing that ages ago (because some claims are provably incorrect in the bible)... so
nowadays, it's only "divinely inspired, but written by men"
Exactly. Everytime Christians are put against the wall with logic they use the "divine inspiration" card. And let's not forget the "God
knows everything, you don't because you're small and your mind is limited" bit.
Interesting argument. For a long time I felt like all this is a game for God.
To You (atheists): when you don't pick a side that's what you will receive.
Are you happy about being the catalyzer of all this bad "people"?
Best regards.
Pick sides? Isn't that a bit childish? Maybe we don't want to "pick sides". Maybe we want others to leave us alone. Maybe we want to be
Switzerland.
I can quote the bible too:Then you can quote the best that there is to quote.
property of his parents.
In ancient Israel, the best laws of the day in the whole world abounded.
The command is to the man. The woman already accepted him. Now he needs to keep his part of the seduction agreement.
Note that the passage, itself, doesn't state who is to do the destroying. Destruction happens to all who will not worship the God of
the ancient Israelites.
This was a great plan. Killing all the people who were against God was a great form of praise and worship. Marrying the virgins helped
to keep in-breeding from happening, at the same time that the Israel men remained righteous by not killing a man and then stealing his
wife.
"In America, a child is the property of his parents." Really? Tell that to Child Services and see how fast they'll take your property.
Even better. Beat the child - you'll never see the kid again.
"Not rape. She accepted his seduction. Voluntarily." You don't have kids, do you? Or a daughter? Now if my daughter would get raped and
someone would tell me she accepted his seduction things would not end very well.
"This is an Old Testament command to the nation of Israel". Then let the "Israel from the old testament" to follow that rule. We'll
live in the current age of the world.
"Destruction happens to all who will not worship the God of the ancient Israelites."; Also: God chose favorites. It's not about all
people. The people of Israel are more special than us others. Let then the people of Israel to follow the rules that God created for
His favourites.
"This was a great plan. Killing all the people". I'll stop here with that quote. It's self explanatory. And again: it applies to the
people of Israel.
Where did you get that idea? It makes zero sense...
Just think about it... I know it's difficult, but try to put yourself in God's shoes for 2 seconds...
You are God... you are all-powerful... what do you do? Create a universe for the sole purpose of having these little ants worship you?
Nope... that's not it...
Ok, no more playing God, you are back to yourself again... Would you create an ant-farm and try to convince them to worship you? Would
you be super happy if a few of them did worship you? Does any of this make sense?
You have not thought about the glory of God deeply, what it is and how it works. You have not thought about what praise of God really
is, or how (in the case of praising God) the praise raises the people doing the praising up towards the level of Godness.
"the praise raises the people doing the praising up towards the level of Godness."? That makes no sense. Certain things, like gravity
can't be disputed because they're logical. Your way of thinking goes against gravity.
God says it Himself in the bible.
God didn't write the bible, Christians stopped believing that ages ago (because some claims are provably incorrect in the bible)... so
nowadays, it's only "divinely inspired, but written by men"
God is a Spirit. He doesn't pick up pen and paper, and write.
Rather, God infused the minds and spirits of certain people who believed in Him, with the words that He wanted written. Then they wrote
as He directed.
Bible claims are not incorrect. Often the understanding of people is backwards enough that they don't understand the claims of the
Bible correctly.
Just because a Christian doesn't understand everything in the Bible, doesn't make him a non-Christian. As long as he believes that
Jesus has forgiven him for his mistakes, he is forgiven and saved.
Why God only "infuses" minds? Why doesn't He show Himself? Don't tell me He's affraid!
"As long as he believes that Jesus has forgiven him for his mistakes, he is forgiven and saved." So: has Jesus forgiven sinners already
or not? Which is it?
Without religion and "The Dark Ages", we would be 300+ years more advanced in terms of science and technology... religion
destroys science, murders scientists... religions burned the Library of Alexandria... not once, not twice, but THREE TIMES!
This such a true and sad, sad fact! We could have been so far ahead, it's heartbreaking. because it can be seen how many lives science
saves, but no! Religion doesn't want to save lives, religion wants to save souls, and for that you have to die!
If I believed in מלך, I would not be an Atheist, would I?
Why would you believe in the Christian God? He's a murderer! He also commands his followers to murder nearly everyone...
According to the bible, God personally murders:
The world with a flood (20 million?)
Sodom and Gammorah (50k?)
The firstborn son of every Egyptian (100k?) (Exodus 11:5)
The Egyptian army (a lot of soldiers)
The Assyrians (185,000) (2 Kings 19:35)
Isrealites (500,000+) (Numbers 16:49, Numbers 25:9, Deuteronomy 2:14-16, 1 Samuel 6:19, 2 Samuel 24)
...and many more...
God orders the Israelites to murder:
All the men, women and children in 60 cities (60 cities?!?) (Deuteronomy 3:6)
The Midianites (Numbers 31:17)
Jericho (Joshua 6:21)
The Cananites (Judges 1:4)
The Moabites (Judges 3:28)
...and many more...
Satan murders:
Sarah (1)
Job's wife, children, and servants (a dozen?) (this was completely condoned by God)
...and that's the complete list...
According to the bible, Satan kills a baker's dozen, while God kills by the millions...
God orders the Israelites to murder by the hundreds of thousands, committing genocide over a dozen times!... completely wiping out
civilizations!
And all this because: praise God or die! no third option.
Part 1:
The death on the cross for Jesus was necessary. It shows us how greatly God loves us...
Say what? Necessary?!?
God made the rules... he didn't have to make it necessary if he didn't want to... why murder your own son?
God could have waved his magic wand and forgiven sin without any need for bloodshed... necessary? ha!
God sacrifices himself, to himself, to serve as a loophole for a rule he created himself... seems legit...
Exactly. It is said that God knew everything from the beginning. Then why does he allow all this pain and suffering in the world? To
prove a point?
You could ask the same question about 'the flood'...
If God knew he was going to kill 99.999% of the population... why create them in the first place? Why not just start with Noah instead
of Adam? Why kill 99.999% of the population for being evil?...
God created them, knowing they were going to turn out evil... wtf? Now he sent 99.999% of the planet to hell for no reason... why
create any soul that is destined to hell?
That sounds mean to me, creating a soul that you plan to torture for eternity... why would a "God" do that?
This is the main problem with religion... none of the events make a bit of sense when you apply critical thinking skills...
I have to completely agree with Moloch: why would God, who has all His attributes to the superlative: amongst them being "all-knowing",
create a world, only to destroy it later because the beings that He created after a time got bad/evil? Isn't He "all-powerful"? So if
He knows everything what happened? Bad coding? System error? He doesn't make mystakes! He's perfect in all ways!
So, as Moloch said: why the flood? Is it sadism?
Also: sending all the bad souls to hell: for ETERNITY! Because they weren't perfect! Because they were created like that: imperfect.
Moloch, and all of us are trying to use pure reason. I say "trying" because us too are not perfect. Why are you against reason? Against
things that make sense?
I don't know about all atheists but if you leave me alone I'll leave you alone - be contempt in your made up world, it's ok. But stop
trying to convince us about God's existence!
Atheists are the reason for some of the most brutal murders around, way more than Christians. Consider Stalin and his 30 to 100 million
(we may never know for sure), Hitler and his 20 million (he wasn't Christian although he went to mass at times), and all the Southeast
Asian atheistic communistic leaders who killed many millions of their own people.
If Bible were law, there would be peace among those who accepted it as law. Take a look. It's right in the Bible.
(we may never know for sure), Hitler and his 20 million (he wasn't Christian although he went to mass at times), and all the Southeast
Asian atheistic communistic leaders who killed many millions of their own people.
If Bible were law, there would be peace among those who accepted it as law. Take a look. It's right in the Bible.
Anyone who compares the opposition to Hitler, automatically loses any argument they tried to make.
Hitler didn't kill any(?) Jews himself, other Germans did that... and guess what... those Germans were mostly Christian, same as
America!... that means Christians did all that evil murdering... get your facts right...
Religion is the force responsible for the vast majority of wars throughout history. Christians are solely responsible for what we
commonly refer to as "The Dark Ages"... 300 years of crusades, and inquisition!
Just read the bible... how many nations did the Jews attack? "The Promised Land", "The land of milk and honey", was such because there
were people living on that land... they were farmers and bee-keepers, which is why they had milk and honey... until the Jews killed
them all and took their milk and honey... that's how religion operates... they kill and take people's stuff... all the while claiming
moral authority directly from God Himself!
Again: if Christians are so good why have so many people died in the name of God? Something's wrong here, I tell you.
The death on the cross for Jesus was necessary. It shows us how greatly God loves us...
Say what? Necessary?!?
God made the rules... he didn't have to make it necessary if he didn't want to... why murder your own son?
God could have waved his magic wand and forgiven sin without any need for bloodshed... necessary? ha!
God sacrifices himself, to himself, to serve as a loophole for a rule he created himself... seems legit...
Exactly. It is said that God knew everything from the beginning. Then why does he allow all this pain and suffering in the world? To
prove a point?
You could ask the same question about 'the flood'...
If God knew he was going to kill 99.999% of the population... why create them in the first place? Why not just start with Noah instead
of Adam? Why kill 99.999% of the population for being evil?...
God created them, knowing they were going to turn out evil... wtf? Now he sent 99.999% of the planet to hell for no reason... why
create any soul that is destined to hell?
That sounds mean to me, creating a soul that you plan to torture for eternity... why would a "God" do that?
This is the main problem with religion... none of the events make a bit of sense when you apply critical thinking skills...
You forget one thing. God loved us so much, that He did the best for us. What is that best? God is giving us in our selves, Himself. He
is making us like Him. We have the choice to be like Him or not. How do we have that choice? He gave it to us. Either join Him and be
like Him, or do away with ourselves.
What's the question here? I'd slap you ion the face if I was God. And to think He offers you the greatest thing that there is... to be
like Him. And you even suggest turning it down. What an insult. Even you would be insulted if you offered someone a million dollars,
and besides not accepting it, all he did was to call you a piece of shit to your face.
His best? There is no "best" for Him. He's perfect, no? All encompassing.
Also: God is three persons: God is God, Jesus is God, the holy spirit is God. Three persons, one being. Then God killed Himself? Also:
if He killed Himself knowing that He would not really die what does that prove? Who wouldn't die without a problem if he/she would have
the certainty that after three days he/she would be again alive without a scratch?
To You:
"Not to pass your children through the fire to Molech"
- Lev. 18:21
Best regards.
"Not to pass your children through the fire to Molech"
- Lev. 18:21
Best regards.
There are certainly better Moloch quotes... Allen Ginsberg did an amazing job:
Howl by Allen Ginsberg : The Poetry Foundation
Quote
Moloch! Solitude! Filth! Ugliness! Ashcans and unobtainable dollars! Children screaming under the stairways! Boys sobbing in
armies! Old men weeping in the parks!
Moloch! Moloch! Nightmare of Moloch! Moloch the loveless! Mental Moloch! Moloch the heavy judger of men!
Moloch the incomprehensible prison! Moloch the crossbone soulless jailhouse and Congress of sorrows! Moloch whose buildings are
judgment! Moloch the vast stone of war! Moloch the stunned governments!
Moloch whose mind is pure machinery! Moloch whose blood is running money! Moloch whose fingers are ten armies! Moloch whose breast is a
cannibal dynamo! Moloch whose ear is a smoking tomb!
Moloch whose eyes are a thousand blind windows! Moloch whose skyscrapers stand in the long streets like endless Jehovahs! Moloch whose
factories dream and croak in the fog! Moloch whose smoke-stacks and antennae crown the cities!
Moloch whose love is endless oil and stone! Moloch whose soul is electricity and banks! Moloch whose poverty is the specter of genius!
Moloch whose fate is a cloud of sexless hydrogen! Moloch whose name is the Mind!
...
armies! Old men weeping in the parks!
Moloch! Moloch! Nightmare of Moloch! Moloch the loveless! Mental Moloch! Moloch the heavy judger of men!
Moloch the incomprehensible prison! Moloch the crossbone soulless jailhouse and Congress of sorrows! Moloch whose buildings are
judgment! Moloch the vast stone of war! Moloch the stunned governments!
Moloch whose mind is pure machinery! Moloch whose blood is running money! Moloch whose fingers are ten armies! Moloch whose breast is a
cannibal dynamo! Moloch whose ear is a smoking tomb!
Moloch whose eyes are a thousand blind windows! Moloch whose skyscrapers stand in the long streets like endless Jehovahs! Moloch whose
factories dream and croak in the fog! Moloch whose smoke-stacks and antennae crown the cities!
Moloch whose love is endless oil and stone! Moloch whose soul is electricity and banks! Moloch whose poverty is the specter of genius!
Moloch whose fate is a cloud of sexless hydrogen! Moloch whose name is the Mind!
...
I believe Allen Ginsberg's Moloch was influenced by the 1927 film,
'Metropolis'
Why are you using this name?
Best regards.
He uses his name because he chose to. Jeez. All the questions.
You forget one thing. God loved us so much, that He did the best for us. What is that best? God is giving us in our selves, Himself. He
is making us like Him. We have the choice to be like Him or not. How do we have that choice? He gave it to us. Either join Him and be
like Him, or do away with ourselves.
What's the question here? I'd slap you ion the face if I was God. And to think He offers you the greatest thing that there is... to be
like Him. And you even suggest turning it down. What an insult. Even you would be insulted if you offered someone a million dollars,
and besides not accepting it, all he did was to call you a piece of shit to your face.
is making us like Him. We have the choice to be like Him or not. How do we have that choice? He gave it to us. Either join Him and be
like Him, or do away with ourselves.
What's the question here? I'd slap you ion the face if I was God. And to think He offers you the greatest thing that there is... to be
like Him. And you even suggest turning it down. What an insult. Even you would be insulted if you offered someone a million dollars,
and besides not accepting it, all he did was to call you a piece of shit to your face.
Why am I not surprised that the "Christian" is the one talking about assaulting the non-Christian? Kinda proving my point about
religion being the aggressor, dontcha think?
Let's say hypothetically, I'm wrong... God exists, he's the Christian God, etc... Would I worship him? FUCK NO!!! The God of
the bible is an evil bastard... I've read the bible... I would never love or worship that God even if the entire bible were 100%
true...
For more info, I'll refer you to Stephen Fry, because he does an amazing job explaining this point:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI
There are so many inconsistencies in the Bible, so many contradictions. I could name 100 without breaking a sweat! With verses to
prove what I say.
Atheists are the reason for some of the most brutal murders around, way more than Christians. Consider Stalin and his 30 to 100 million
(we may never know for sure), Hitler and his 20 million (he wasn't Christian although he went to mass at times), and all the Southeast
Asian atheistic communistic leaders who killed many millions of their own people.
If Bible were law, there would be peace among those who accepted it as law. Take a look. It's right in the Bible.
(we may never know for sure), Hitler and his 20 million (he wasn't Christian although he went to mass at times), and all the Southeast
Asian atheistic communistic leaders who killed many millions of their own people.
If Bible were law, there would be peace among those who accepted it as law. Take a look. It's right in the Bible.
Anyone who compares the opposition to Hitler, automatically loses any argument they tried to make.
Hitler didn't kill any(?) Jews himself, other Germans did that... and guess what... those Germans were mostly Christian, same as
America!... that means Christians did all that evil murdering... get your facts right...
Religion is the force responsible for the vast majority of wars throughout history. Christians are solely responsible for what we
commonly refer to as "The Dark Ages"... 300 years of crusades, and inquisition!
Just read the bible... how many nations did the Jews attack? "The Promised Land", "The land of milk and honey", was such because there
were people living on that land... they were farmers and bee-keepers, which is why they had milk and honey... until the Jews killed
them all and took their milk and honey... that's how religion operates... they kill and take people's stuff... all the while claiming
moral authority directly from God Himself!
You play with semantic-like ideas.
In addition, the Jews who attacked and killed people who didn't believe in God, were doing those people a favor. Here's how.
God is just. He will punish wicked people according to the quantity and quality of their wickedness.
Now imagine as an example that you were 20 years old, and had been wicked all your life. By the time you were, say, 50, wouldn't you
have done a whole lot more wickedness? If you die at 50, you have a lot more to be punished for in Hell than you would have if you died
at 20.
So, here you are, 20, and out fighting the Jews in battle. You die in battle. You have a lot less to pay for in Hell than if you died
at 50, peacefully. The Jews have done you a favor by killing you.
If you had wanted to convert to God and be with the Jews, you could have left your family and the war, and have waited for peaceful
times to contact the Jews to convert. They would have let you.
Here you are right now, fighting against God. And death in youthfulness might even be gone for you, so that you don't build up a larger
amount of wickedness to be punished for in Hell. Turn to God so that He can wipe your wickedness away, so that you don't have to pay
for it in Hell. Such is a free gift from God, if you turn to Him.
Your choice, of course. God holds it open for you until the time of your death. Do you know when that will happen, exactly... the day
of your death, I mean?
Semantic ideas?! Atheists deal with facts! Theologians play with words and semantics, twisting everything until you're dizzy and agree
either because you're tired or all the twistings have "convinced" you. Until you're converted. Then they're (the Christians) happy.
Because that's their agenda. To convert you. They can't be happy alone. Everyone must be like them! They have the absolute truth.
Killing people that don't believe in God is doing them a favor?! Jeez dude! Isn't "thou shall not kill" one of the most sacred of the
ten commandments?! Dying quicker in life is better? That's the most stupid psychologism I've ever heard. Let me quote the man again:
"What have you been smoking dude?".
Also: you have less to pay if you die younger? Isn't hell forever? I mean if you die at 20 you only stay in hell forever instead of
"forever" if you die at 50... How about if I live until 100 and live a rational life without war, religion and other non-sense? And
dedicate my life to art and reason and science?
Fighting against God? He's all powerful. Don't tell me He's affraid. I mean it's enough just to blink and all His enemies would simply
wanish, right? What fighting? People are fighting because He allow it.
So after you die all is lost? You can't repent after death? What's with the rules? If it's true and sincere why not? The rules can't
changed? I mean, again, He is all powerful.
You forget one thing. God loved us so much, that He did the best for us. What is that best? God is giving us in our selves, Himself. He
is making us like Him. We have the choice to be like Him or not. How do we have that choice? He gave it to us. Either join Him and be
like Him, or do away with ourselves.
What's the question here? I'd slap you ion the face if I was God. And to think He offers you the greatest thing that there is... to be
like Him. And you even suggest turning it down. What an insult. Even you would be insulted if you offered someone a million dollars,
and besides not accepting it, all he did was to call you a piece of shit to your face.
is making us like Him. We have the choice to be like Him or not. How do we have that choice? He gave it to us. Either join Him and be
like Him, or do away with ourselves.
What's the question here? I'd slap you ion the face if I was God. And to think He offers you the greatest thing that there is... to be
like Him. And you even suggest turning it down. What an insult. Even you would be insulted if you offered someone a million dollars,
and besides not accepting it, all he did was to call you a piece of shit to your face.
Why am I not surprised that the "Christian" is the one talking about assaulting the non-Christian? Kinda proving my point about
religion being the aggressor, dontcha think?
Let's say hypothetically, I'm wrong... God exists, he's the Christian God, etc... Would I worship him? FUCK NO!!! The God of
the bible is an evil bastard... I've read the bible... I would never love or worship that God even if the entire bible were 100%
true...
For more info, I'll refer you to Stephen Fry, because he does an amazing job explaining this exact point:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI
"The fear of the Lord is the instruction of wisdom; and before honour is humility."
- Pro 15:33
"By humility and the fear of the Lord are riches, and honour, and life."
- Pro 22:4
Don't you like Wisdom and Science?
Best regards.
From what I see Wisdom and Science are exactly what he talks about. What we all are trying to promote.
You forget one thing. God loved us so much, that He did the best for us. What is that best? God is giving us in our selves, Himself. He
is making us like Him. We have the choice to be like Him or not. How do we have that choice? He gave it to us. Either join Him and be
like Him, or do away with ourselves.
What's the question here? I'd slap you ion the face if I was God. And to think He offers you the greatest thing that there is... to be
like Him. And you even suggest turning it down. What an insult. Even you would be insulted if you offered someone a million dollars,
and besides not accepting it, all he did was to call you a piece of shit to your face.
is making us like Him. We have the choice to be like Him or not. How do we have that choice? He gave it to us. Either join Him and be
like Him, or do away with ourselves.
What's the question here? I'd slap you ion the face if I was God. And to think He offers you the greatest thing that there is... to be
like Him. And you even suggest turning it down. What an insult. Even you would be insulted if you offered someone a million dollars,
and besides not accepting it, all he did was to call you a piece of shit to your face.
Why am I not surprised that the "Christian" is the one talking about assaulting the non-Christian? Kinda proving my point about
religion being the aggressor, dontcha think?
Let's say hypothetically, I'm wrong... God exists, he's the Christian God, etc... Would I worship him? FUCK NO!!! The God of
the bible is an evil bastard... I've read the bible... I would never love or worship that God even if the entire bible were 100%
true...
For more info, I'll refer you to Stephen Fry, because he does an amazing job explaining this point:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI
You completely miss the point. You dare to insult God while He is holding your life in His hands. Wouldn't you crush a bug who insulted
you while you were trying to keep it alive? And hearing this, you don't stop, even though God in His mercy waits for you to change. How
long does He have to wait?
If we are so small in front of God why would He be insulted? I don't get insulted if a dog barks at me on the street.
God created Man to adore Him and then when that doesn't happen we are threaten with hell. That's arrogance.
That's not selflessness. We should have been created to be happy not to adore Him so that He can feel better about Himself.
God is just. He will punish wicked people according to the quantity and quality of their wickedness.
Says who?Also, you are phrasing that incorrectly... "God is just" implies that justice exists without God... It's like saying, "God is good"...
well... that's not what you believe... you believe, "Good is God"... whatever God does is just/good, not because the act itself is
good, but because anything God does is exempt... If God decides to murder innocent Egyptian children and animals by the tens of
thousands, its just/good because God did the murdering of innocent children (see the 10th plague of Egypt)
You believe that whatever God does is just/good, not because murder is just/good, but because when God does it, he's special and
exempt...
Now imagine as an example that you were 20 years old, and had been wicked all your life. By the time you were, say, 50, wouldn't you
have done a whole lot more wickedness? If you die at 50, you have a lot more to be punished for in Hell than you would have if you died
at 20.
have done a whole lot more wickedness? If you die at 50, you have a lot more to be punished for in Hell than you would have if you died
at 20.
Why do you assume that someone who doesn't believe in God is wicked/evil? Are all atheists wicked in your eyes? What about Muslims,
Hindu, Buddhist? All evil too?
Just because someone doesn't believe in Santa without evidence, does not make them evil... it makes them less gullible than you...
Right again.
God is just. He will punish wicked people according to the quantity and quality of their wickedness.
Says who?Also, you are phrasing that incorrectly... "God is just" implies that justice exists without God... It's like saying, "God is good"...
well... that's not what you believe... you believe, "Good is God"... whatever God does is just/good, not because the act itself is
good, but because anything God does is exempt... If God decides to murder innocent Egyptian children and animals by the tens of
thousands, its just/good because God did the murdering of innocent children (see the 10th plague of Egypt)
You believe that whatever God does is just/good, not because murder is just/good, but because when God does it, he's special and
exempt...
All the more reason to say things like this to you. Why's that? Because you believe this way, and will understand them well... that's not what you believe... you believe, "Good is God"... whatever God does is just/good, not because the act itself is
good, but because anything God does is exempt... If God decides to murder innocent Egyptian children and animals by the tens of
thousands, its just/good because God did the murdering of innocent children (see the 10th plague of Egypt)
You believe that whatever God does is just/good, not because murder is just/good, but because when God does it, he's special and
exempt...
better.
Now imagine as an example that you were 20 years old, and had been wicked all your life. By the time you were, say, 50, wouldn't you
have done a whole lot more wickedness? If you die at 50, you have a lot more to be punished for in Hell than you would have if you died
at 20.
have done a whole lot more wickedness? If you die at 50, you have a lot more to be punished for in Hell than you would have if you died
at 20.
Why do you assume that someone who doesn't believe in God is wicked/evil? Are all atheists wicked in your eyes? What about Muslims,
Hindu, Buddhist? All evil too?
Just because someone doesn't believe in Santa without evidence, does not make them evil... it makes them less gullible than you...
Everyone who does not believe in God is wicked and evil. Why? Because one of the greatest things God made us for is to praise and
worship Him. If a person doesn't believe in God, any praise of God he does will only be incidental. He is not allowing himself to do
the thing that God made him for. This is wickedness... very great evil.
God didn't make people to go to Hell. When people in their stupidity and ignorance opted for the Hell route, God left a way open for
them to be saved. And this way wasn't only with the idea of simple salvation. It is designed to give people some of the glory of
Jesus... to be like God. And you want to throw it away.
God doesn't say anything in the Bible. God did not write the Bible. Men did.
"Everyone who does not believe in God is wicked and evil." Jeez dude! I don't like to call people stupid because I wouldn't like to be
called like that but you're asking for it. God gave us free will. So we're using it. If He wanted mindless drones He should have
created that! He gives us free will and then when we exercise it He gets upset? That's not right.
So He created us to worship Him and He did us a favor? Are you really that brainwashed? I mean, you do realize that makes no sense
right?
"The fear of the Lord is the instruction of wisdom; and before honour is humility."
- Pro 15:33
"By humility and the fear of the Lord are riches, and honour, and life."
- Pro 22:4
Don't you like Wisdom and Science?
Best regards.
- Pro 15:33
"By humility and the fear of the Lord are riches, and honour, and life."
- Pro 22:4
Don't you like Wisdom and Science?
Best regards.
I can quote the bible too:
"If a man sells his daughter as a servant, she is not to go free as male servants do. If she does not please the master who has
selected her for himself, he must let her be redeemed. He has no right to sell her to foreigners, because he has broken faith with
her." Exodus 21:7
"Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be
punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property." Exodus 21:20
"If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his
wife." Exodus 22:16
(This is a great law for any rapist who wants to marry his rape victim... not so fun for the woman who is required to marry her rapist)
"Whoever sacrifices to any god other than the Lord must be destroyed" Exodus 22:20
(better start killing those other religions... God commands you to!)
"Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a
man." Numbers 31:17-18
(kill all the men, but keep the virgins as your property... now that's a plan!)
Can you answer questions?
Best regards.
No answers needed. Those verses speak for themselves. And actually he did answer, in between the parantheses under the verses.
God is just. He will punish wicked people according to the quantity and quality of their wickedness.
Says who?God didn't write the bible, Christians stopped believing that ages ago (because some claims are provably incorrect in the bible)... so
nowadays, it's only "divinely inspired, but written by men"
Exactly. Everytime Christians are put against the wall with logic they use the "divine inspiration" card. And let's not forget the "God
knows everything, you don't because you're small and your mind is limited" bit.
Let's not even mention the fact that playing by the rules God supposedly created himself, he is destined to get fewer souls than
Satan...
Only around 30% of the world is Christian (even counting Mormons, etc)... If God gets <50% of the souls, he loses the game to Satan...
Why would he create and play such a game?
Satan...
Only around 30% of the world is Christian (even counting Mormons, etc)... If God gets <50% of the souls, he loses the game to Satan...
Why would he create and play such a game?
Interesting argument. For a long time I felt like all this is a game for God.
Let's not even mention the fact that playing by the rules God supposedly created himself, he is destined to get fewer souls than
Satan...
Only around 30% of the world is Christian (even counting Mormons, etc)... If God gets <50% of the souls, he loses the game to Satan...
Why would he create and play such a game?
Satan...
Only around 30% of the world is Christian (even counting Mormons, etc)... If God gets <50% of the souls, he loses the game to Satan...
Why would he create and play such a game?
To You (atheists): when you don't pick a side that's what you will receive.
Are you happy about being the catalyzer of all this bad "people"?
Best regards.
Pick sides? Isn't that a bit childish? Maybe we don't want to "pick sides". Maybe we want others to leave us alone. Maybe we want to be
Switzerland.
"The fear of the Lord is the instruction of wisdom; and before honour is humility."
- Pro 15:33
"By humility and the fear of the Lord are riches, and honour, and life."
- Pro 22:4
Don't you like Wisdom and Science?
Best regards.
- Pro 15:33
"By humility and the fear of the Lord are riches, and honour, and life."
- Pro 22:4
Don't you like Wisdom and Science?
Best regards.
I can quote the bible too:
"If a man sells his daughter as a servant, she is not to go free as male servants do. If she does not please the master who has
selected her for himself, he must let her be redeemed. He has no right to sell her to foreigners, because he has broken faith with
her." Exodus 21:7
"Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be
punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property." Exodus 21:20
In America, a child is the selected her for himself, he must let her be redeemed. He has no right to sell her to foreigners, because he has broken faith with
her." Exodus 21:7
"Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be
punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property." Exodus 21:20
property of his parents.
In ancient Israel, the best laws of the day in the whole world abounded.
"If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his
wife." Exodus 22:16
(This is a great law for any rapist who wants to marry his rape victim... not so fun for the woman who is required to marry her
rapist)
Not rape. She accepted his seduction. Voluntarily. wife." Exodus 22:16
(This is a great law for any rapist who wants to marry his rape victim... not so fun for the woman who is required to marry her
rapist)
The command is to the man. The woman already accepted him. Now he needs to keep his part of the seduction agreement.
"Whoever sacrifices to any god other than the Lord must be destroyed" Exodus 22:20
(better start killing those other religions... God commands you to!)
This is an Old Testament command to the nation of Israel. (better start killing those other religions... God commands you to!)
Note that the passage, itself, doesn't state who is to do the destroying. Destruction happens to all who will not worship the God of
the ancient Israelites.
"Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a
man." Numbers 31:17-18
(kill all the men, but keep the virgins as your property... now that's a plan!)
man." Numbers 31:17-18
(kill all the men, but keep the virgins as your property... now that's a plan!)
This was a great plan. Killing all the people who were against God was a great form of praise and worship. Marrying the virgins helped
to keep in-breeding from happening, at the same time that the Israel men remained righteous by not killing a man and then stealing his
wife.
"In America, a child is the property of his parents." Really? Tell that to Child Services and see how fast they'll take your property.
Even better. Beat the child - you'll never see the kid again.
"Not rape. She accepted his seduction. Voluntarily." You don't have kids, do you? Or a daughter? Now if my daughter would get raped and
someone would tell me she accepted his seduction things would not end very well.
"This is an Old Testament command to the nation of Israel". Then let the "Israel from the old testament" to follow that rule. We'll
live in the current age of the world.
"Destruction happens to all who will not worship the God of the ancient Israelites."; Also: God chose favorites. It's not about all
people. The people of Israel are more special than us others. Let then the people of Israel to follow the rules that God created for
His favourites.
"This was a great plan. Killing all the people". I'll stop here with that quote. It's self explanatory. And again: it applies to the
people of Israel.
God made us to praise and worship Him.
Where did you get that idea? It makes zero sense...
Just think about it... I know it's difficult, but try to put yourself in God's shoes for 2 seconds...
You are God... you are all-powerful... what do you do? Create a universe for the sole purpose of having these little ants worship you?
Nope... that's not it...
Ok, no more playing God, you are back to yourself again... Would you create an ant-farm and try to convince them to worship you? Would
you be super happy if a few of them did worship you? Does any of this make sense?
You have not thought about the glory of God deeply, what it is and how it works. You have not thought about what praise of God really
is, or how (in the case of praising God) the praise raises the people doing the praising up towards the level of Godness.
"the praise raises the people doing the praising up towards the level of Godness."? That makes no sense. Certain things, like gravity
can't be disputed because they're logical. Your way of thinking goes against gravity.
God is just. He will punish wicked people according to the quantity and quality of their wickedness.
Says who?God didn't write the bible, Christians stopped believing that ages ago (because some claims are provably incorrect in the bible)... so
nowadays, it's only "divinely inspired, but written by men"
God is a Spirit. He doesn't pick up pen and paper, and write.
Rather, God infused the minds and spirits of certain people who believed in Him, with the words that He wanted written. Then they wrote
as He directed.
Bible claims are not incorrect. Often the understanding of people is backwards enough that they don't understand the claims of the
Bible correctly.
Just because a Christian doesn't understand everything in the Bible, doesn't make him a non-Christian. As long as he believes that
Jesus has forgiven him for his mistakes, he is forgiven and saved.
"As long as he believes that Jesus has forgiven him for his mistakes, he is forgiven and saved." So: has Jesus forgiven sinners already
or not? Which is it?
How do you reach Wisdom and Science without the Lord?
Without religion and "The Dark Ages", we would be 300+ years more advanced in terms of science and technology... religion
destroys science, murders scientists... religions burned the Library of Alexandria... not once, not twice, but THREE TIMES!
This such a true and sad, sad fact! We could have been so far ahead, it's heartbreaking. because it can be seen how many lives science
saves, but no! Religion doesn't want to save lives, religion wants to save souls, and for that you have to die!
Do you believe the Molech?
If I believed in מלך, I would not be an Atheist, would I?
Why would you believe in the Christian God? He's a murderer! He also commands his followers to murder nearly everyone...
According to the bible, God personally murders:
The world with a flood (20 million?)
Sodom and Gammorah (50k?)
The firstborn son of every Egyptian (100k?) (Exodus 11:5)
The Egyptian army (a lot of soldiers)
The Assyrians (185,000) (2 Kings 19:35)
Isrealites (500,000+) (Numbers 16:49, Numbers 25:9, Deuteronomy 2:14-16, 1 Samuel 6:19, 2 Samuel 24)
...and many more...
God orders the Israelites to murder:
All the men, women and children in 60 cities (60 cities?!?) (Deuteronomy 3:6)
The Midianites (Numbers 31:17)
Jericho (Joshua 6:21)
The Cananites (Judges 1:4)
The Moabites (Judges 3:28)
...and many more...
Satan murders:
Sarah (1)
Job's wife, children, and servants (a dozen?) (this was completely condoned by God)
...and that's the complete list...
According to the bible, Satan kills a baker's dozen, while God kills by the millions...
God orders the Israelites to murder by the hundreds of thousands, committing genocide over a dozen times!... completely wiping out
civilizations!
And all this because: praise God or die! no third option.
Do you believe the Molech?