Quote from: organofcorti on March 25, 2016, 11:51:33 AM

Quote from: BADecker on March 25, 2016, 11:15:25 AM

Quote from: organofcorti on March 25, 2016, 10:45:05 AM

I'll never get tired of writing this:

Quote from: organofcorti on March 01, 2016, 01:42:32 AM

"complex universe" is not a law. If you think it is, please link to a peer reviewed paper which asserts that there is a law called the "complex universe law".

Call our complex universe what you will or what you will not. But the fact is that the complexity of our universe is a fact.

What this means is, if science somehow fails to recognize cause and effect as a law of science, then science is simply remiss in this area.

Not recognised by science? So you're admitting "complex universe" not a scientific law then?

Your duplicity, as usual ^^.

Quote from: organofcorti on March 25, 2016, 02:30:24 PM

Quote from: CoinCube on March 25, 2016, 01:02:01 PM

Quote from: Buffer Overflow on March 25, 2016, 07:56:46 AM

...
Christianity relies on free will. Without it people cannot ask for salivation, rendering Christianity false.

So take your pick:

1) We don't have free will. Thus Christainity is false.
2) We do have free will. Christainity could be true.

Delayed choice quantum eraser experiments tell us that certain quantum phenomena operate outside of what we traditionally think of as time.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delayed_choice_quantum_eraser

Quote

Delayed choice experiments raise questions about time and time sequences, and thereby bring our usual ideas of time and causal sequence into question.[note 1] If events at D1, D2, D3, D4 determine outcomes at D0, then effect seems to precede cause. If the idler light paths were greatly extended so that a year goes by before a photon shows up at D1, D2, D3, or D4, then when a photon shows up in one of these detectors, it would cause a signal photon to have shown up in a certain mode a year earlier. Alternatively, knowledge of the future fate of the idler photon would determine the activity of the signal photon in its own present. Neither of these ideas conforms to the usual human expectation of causality.

Orch OR theory posits that conscious arises from quantum computations in brain microtubules.
As noted by Kant in his model of a noumenal self free will requires a true self that is independent of time.
Grounding consciousness in quantum mechanics provides this independence.

Therefore we have free will.

Why do we "ground consciousness in quantum mechanics"? Is there some experiment that proves consciousness is a phenomenon affected more by quantum scale effects? I'm astonished - I didn't even know we were at the point that consciousness was that well understood.

If OTOH you're just putting forward a conjecture then until there is proof we cannot know whether or not free will exists.

You didn't see the word "theory?" And you are right. Theory is conjecture.

Cool