Quote from: SebastianJu on January 17, 2013, 11:25:04 PM

Quote from: DiabloD3 on January 17, 2013, 01:43:39 PM

Quote from: MPOE-PR on January 17, 2013, 01:30:39 PM

Quote from: friedcat on January 17, 2013, 12:42:49 PM

However, the shareholders of ASICMINER are always in a better place

Props for the decency to present it as an equity deal from day one, rather than calling stock subscription "preorders" like everyone else.

Yeah, this. It still pisses me off how BFL abused all of their investors by calling them customers and called their investments preorders. Between BFL and bASIC, a lot of bullshit has gone on that ASICMINER and Avalon and the entire Bitcoin community could have done without.

But it was pretty clear from the start that you invest as a shareholder in asicminer and that the chips from bfl has to be created first. That wasnt hidden. So everyone who bought there played the game and lost. That happens. But i dont think thats a reason to blame bfl. They are late but that was part of the things that can happen from the start.

The thing is, in North America you are not allowed to accept payment for an item that is not ready to ship. You probably noticed that if you order something backordered they will refund the payment and recharge once they receive the item and ship (if payment was cleared at checkout, if not they will just charge later). Or when you preorder something (a PS3 game for example) you merely save your place in queue and they charge on the release date. BFL was not allowed to take the money before building the rigs. And they knew it too, because I initially ordered some and they were saying "no refunds", and I just emailed saying I want a refund because it is not legal and I would pursue ligitigation if they refused. Next day, full refund no questions asked. That people knew or not that the items were not ready does not make taking money first then manufacture legal. So yeah, they are to blame to use illegal practice to run their business.