Quote from: Rassah on May 11, 2016, 07:47:44 PM

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

Part 1
Unacceptable practices:
Giving a 10% discount to people expressing interest prior to the sale.
You don't have to be a genius to see how bad of a practice this is for securities (note: this crowdsale isn't even a security) that are supposedly representing a stake in a company.

It's a common practice for companies to sell, or give away for free, stock to employees and company insiders. We are just doing this for the initial public. Note our "insiders," those being managers and owners, will not be buying to avoid any conflicts of interest.

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

Promising investors part of the money received from future crowdsales
In their own words:

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You get the share of Mycelium and the right to receive money whenever Mycelium gets more expensive. Let's suppose that this time, with this crowdsale, it will be valued at 100 million USD. Imagine that when we sell another portion one year later it will be valued at 1 billion USD. So you will get 900 million USD multiplied by your portion (if you are the owner of 5% you will get 5% of 900 million = 45 million). Your initial investment stays with you: you keep owning this right and it is non-dilutable. The next 20% we sell will be dilutable.

Remember that a Cyprus-based holding company is involved, and Mycelium operations are supposedly Latvian-based. This is a borderline pyramid scheme setup and illegal for securities in most of the world.

You buy a share of company stock at $x. That means you are literally owner of $x amount of the company, including company assets such as cash. If the company valuation grows, such as from a second round of investments or from increased revenues, your $x worth of stock grows. Then if the company offers to repurchase stock shares, you can trade your stock for the amount of cash that you literally already own. How is this set up any different?

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

Absolutely zero legal fallback

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There will be no refunds. Token is not a security, is not listed, authorized, issued or traded on any regulated market.

Wrong about no legal feedback. Yes, tokens are not traded on regulated markets, but SARs typically are not. You do get a legal signed contract between you and the company which gives you the legal right to any growth in company value, which you can take to court to claim your right. This isn't just ETH token that only represents what people feel about ETH's growth, this is an actual legal contract granting you legal rights.
As for no refunds, refunds aren't given during valuation sales because otherwise those sales would never go anywhere. A few people invest, see too little has been invested, and pull back out. Next group invests, sees too little, and pulls out. Valuation never goes above zero. That's why there are no refunds in these types of sales.

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

No ETA on project rollout

You said no ETA, and then literally linked to where an ETA was given. We're sorry we can't give you an exact date, but we have experience launching big projects, and know they will always be delayed beyond whatever date is giver. So we see no point besides a generalization. Remember Butterfly Labs? Etherium? Practically everything else in this space?

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

and the creators have no clear idea how it's going to be built or even what it's going to be. You're you would literally be buying a stake in vapourware.
part 2

It is being build on ReactNative, with Bitcore as the initial bitcoin library. The initial planning began in August, development began in late October, and the project has been in development for over 6 months. At this point the development platform is set up, UI is done, app development has started and works for sending coins, and we are currently in the process of developing the API. Regarding what it's going to be, it's on the web page, the press releases, and a dozen or so articles discussing it in depth, about what it will be, what our business plans are, and how it will make money. Or you could ask. We are not a secretive company. I'm all over the place and am pretty easy to reach.

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

Why this has a high chance of being a loss:
First things first, up to this point, could you name anything that Mycelium did that was a commercial success? Their wallet software was free and not monetized, which is nice for users but not for potential investors. A supposed advantage of this crowdsale is dividends but there's no talk about how they're going to turn in profit.

Mycelium Entropy was a success. More than half was sold our before it was done, the rest was sold out, and then some, shortly after. Demand was so high we ran out of units. We made a pretty good profit on that. The wallet itself is a success too. Consistently ranked among the top bitcoin wallets, over 300,000 downloads, over 200,000 active users, a strong brand recognition and an extremely loyal user base.

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

They are granting themselvs the right to repurchase shares at the initial price.
There's no clear plan on how this project is potentially going to turn in profit, but even in the unlikely event that the project becomes profitable, they could buy back the shares at the initial price and end their obligation to investors.

Regarding the shares being bought back at the initial price, you, along with unfortunately many others, misunderstood what these shares you are buying are. The token itself is just a contract, used to prove that you are a legitimate owner. Think of them as just a really expensive piece of paper. What those tokens give you are Stock Appreciation Rights (SAR), which grants you a legal right to any increase in company valuation. So if you buy a token for $1, and the company grows 10 times, your token is still worth $1, which is what we will repurchase it for, but your SAR, the right attached to that token, is worth $9, which you can exchange for cash, or if we ever have an IPO, can convert directly to equivalent share of stock. And, should the wallet ever get a profit, those tokens will be converted to dividend paying assets, allowing you to receive a share of those profits. Basically, instead of the usual shares of stock that we are used to, which themselves grow with company value, SARs themselves don't grow, but have a right attached to them which, when combined with the SAR, grow together like a share of stock would.

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

Can only invest in the wallet but there's no guarantee that the money will be spent on it instead of other projects (that Mycelium won't pay investors dividends for)

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And do I have a guarantee that the collected funds will only be used for the wallet project and not for the rest of the company?

Not entirely, but that's mainly because eventually all of the rest of our company will be rolled into this wallet. Most of the expense will be used to pay Wallet developer salaries, but some of our resources (like office and general brand marketing) are shared, so it would be difficult to keep completely separate. Sorry I can't give a more satisfactory answer.

We have only one Accounting, Legal, and HR department for the whole company. And it's very likely that other of Mycelium's projects will just be rolled into the wallet eventually anyway. I know this raises some concerns, but I can't give a better answer in this case.

Quote from: alani123 on April 30, 2016, 08:19:06 PM

Tokens are released in their own platform.
So fair distribution is entirely based on trust, as well as trading. Yet they claim that Token owners can either sell them on the open market at any moment or redeem to us if conditions are met, which is misleading at best.

Tokens will be issued as colored coins, which you can hold and trade now in Colu wallet, and will be able to hold and trade from within Mycelium wallet by the end of the month. We expect exchanges will adopt the Colu platform and allow trading them on the market soon too. So I don't know why this is misleading.

wel thank you for explaining .i invested some coin but i was a little woried becouse a lot of people think that this is a scam.
now the sky is clear i feel good.
thank you