Quote from: TwitchySeal on August 13, 2016, 01:22:09 AM

Responding here to cjmoles post in the [Beware] TwitchySeal: Abuses his Rep, replies to his own posts with alts, etc thread.

Quote from: cjmoles on August 12, 2016, 09:32:40 PM

-snip-
If the jackpot cannot be won on a "free spin," then it is only right to specify that point for the players who don't realize it.
-snip-

No player should "realize it" if it's not written anywhere.

Quote from: cjmoles on August 12, 2016, 09:32:40 PM

-snip-
If the rules were not clarified, then people who don't understand the difference between "free" and "maximum" would still think that "free spins" qualify under the only "max bet wager" qualifies rule, by extension, when they actually don't. All of it is coded into the software....
-snip-

Jason bet the maximum. The result of his maximum wager was free spins. These freespins pay out based on the ammount of the wager that triggered them. (in this case, the maximum) At no point was jason given the option to bet more. If he had been, and he decided not to bet as much as he could, then he would not be eligible for the jackpot (according to the rules at the time). That's not what happened though. He bet the maximum.

Quote from: cjmoles on August 12, 2016, 09:32:40 PM

if "free spins" did qualify as a maximum bet, then the jackpot would've dropped because it would've been coded into the software....but it wasn't coded into the software because free spins don't qualify, so the jackpot didn't drop.

I somewhat agree with you hear. All things considered, it's pretty hard to draw any conclusion other than the software is coded so that large jackpots like this one simply can not be won.

Quote from: cjmoles on August 12, 2016, 09:32:40 PM

And, whoever said Betcoin changed the timestamp is lying because the opposite was true....they completely overlooked the timestamp.

No, they changed the time stamp.
The problem is, they didn't change it until after I called them out for changing their terms in June 2016 without telling players and leaving the "last updated Jan 2015"

Weeks later they claimed it was an accident. Considering their history. there's only a tiny chance that they aren't lying, in my opinion.

Quote from: cjmoles on August 12, 2016, 09:32:40 PM

The rules were not changed; they were clarified for those who didn't understand them which was the right thing to do, not the wrong thing to do.

They added a rule about not being able to win the Jackpot during freespins. This was a change.

Quote from: cjmoles on August 12, 2016, 09:32:40 PM

Do you also believe that the rules were clear enough to avoid clarifying that point? Should they have left them the way they were or does it help to have them clarified?

The rules are not clear enough. They need to clarify where these jackpots are receiving funds from/which sites they can be won at. They need to clarify what happens when a jackpot is won: does the player receive the whole thing? How do they seed the new jackpot? What are the odds of hitting a jackpot? Do the chances vary from denomination to denomination?

If they don't want the jackpot to be eligible during free spins, that's fine. But it's not fine to add this rule and enforce it retroactively. I believe they only did this because they do not consdier that 500BTC jackpot as money the players are entitled to. They believe they have no intention of paying that BTC500 jackpot.

Quote from: cjmoles on August 12, 2016, 10:27:04 PM

1) "Greedy Goblins" is not the game in question as you are claiming; the game in question is called, "The Glam Life."

2) You are right....the jackpot cannot be won on "The Glam Life" during free spins because free spins do not qualify as max bet wagers as stated in the game's rules and coded into the software.

3) Jumping from the rules as stated in one game, re-interpreting them to fit your argument, and then applying that interpretation to a totally different game with a different set of conditions IS a great leap in logic.

I was using Greedy Goblins to prove that the possibility of winning a Progressive Jackpots during a freespin or bonus round is nothing out of the ordinary. There is no "unspoken rule" that Progressive Jackpots can't be won if your other-wise qualifying bet results in multiple "spins" or a bonus round. In fact, it's quite common.

Unless otherwise noted, if a player makes a bet and triggers "freespins" they should expect these "freespins" to payout based on their initial wager.

It's interesting to see cjmoles is now making a very similiar argument that Betcoin made right off the bat:

Quote from: Betcoin Support

Betsoft has been doing this for well over 10 years servicing the top online casinos in the industry. You would have the same answer on any other casino. We have dealt with this before that is why I mentioned it in my first reply despite the fact that you did not mention it was a bonus round. They have also dealt with this many times before, but most players understand that it is a bonus or free round and there are different outcomes because of that.

Quote from: Betcoin Support

The point is this isn't the first time this has happened. Most people understand this clearly and move on especially due to the fact that it is a bonus round and you can't even bet the max that qualifies for the jackpot.

Interesting change of tune from this:

Quote from: cjmoles on June 22, 2016, 09:35:05 PM

What can we do to make sure jasonort gets what he is owed. Betsoft needs to be held accountable! Maybe Betsoft, and any of it's supporters, should be blacklisted from the market! I personally trust betcoin.ag and Bodog (Bovada), but Betsoft needs to be dealt with in a strong handed manner....In fact, I'm feeling cheated now too and I want all the money back that I've spent playing on their software chasing those progressives! <--Not that I believe that would ever happen, but for jasonort, what can we do to put the hurt on these thieves?

Quote from: cjmoles on July 05, 2016, 11:17:23 PM

Just got an Email from Bovada and they are disabling all their Betsoft games until they can figure out what to do about the problems with the Betsoft software. They're acknowledging there's a problem and they are investigating the situation.

Betcoin has over 70 individual progressive Jackpots totalling around 3,000 bitcoin (almost 2 million USD).

Assuming the jackpots are listed in the number of credits at that specific denomination...
The two highest denom jackpots for Glam Life account for more than 80% of the combined value of all Betcoins 70+ progressives.
These two jackpots are currently worth BTC 2,520.5205 (about $1,490,000)
503.6385BTC for the .5 denom and 2,016.882BTC for 1 denom

In the past 37 days, the .5 denom jackpot has grown by BTC0.002
The BTC2,016.882 Glam Life 1 denom jackpot has not grown in the past 37 days.

If you compare the jackpots at other sites (specifically the GETJACKPOT ping response from Betsoft servers) they are not linked.
For example the same two Glam Life .5 and 1 denom jackpots above are worth over BTC500 more for a total of BTC3,025.002 on Bitcasino.io

It's pretty clear the same thing is happening at Bitcoin casinos that was discovered about Bovada slots in this thread, as in many Betsoft Jackpots are simply "turned off". As in, they continue to collect 1% (or 2% in some cases) and contribute it to the "jackpot" but only the smaller jackpots have any possibility of being hit. As in, Betsoft is stealing from their affiliates based on this 1 or 2% and lying to the everyone about prize that can not be won.

JasonOrt has given up on his 500BTC jackpot long ago. His case and the way it was handled is just another example of the current pathetic state of Betcoin and Bitcoin gaming in general.

Yes, my stance did change once Betsoft resolved the issue with jasonort and after I looked at all the details, and realized that I was being manipulated with inaccurate information. I don't like cheaters or thieves just as much as the next person and probably more....but liars and false accusers are just as bad. I'll stand up for those who are cheated, but I don't like being manipulated with false information to attack honest people to satisfy other people's perverted agendas. Believe me, I've done thorough research on the subject and I am no slouch when it comes to probability, normal distribution, or variance, nor am I a slouch when it comes to statistical analysis and legal research. I don't have all this free time to engage in weird debates, gamble, and do whatever I feel like because I'm dumb and poor....I earned my bones in life and I have more than I could ever possibly use as a result....No, I'm here because I believe in this stuff....I'm no bum hunter....I've been around the game a lot longer then you realize.