Quote from: JayJuanGee on July 25, 2016, 09:14:34 PM

Quote from: adamstgBit on July 25, 2016, 08:17:28 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on July 25, 2016, 07:42:01 PM

[edited out]

part of me feels all this, node count, minning in china, bitcoin "centraliztion", is all completely over stated. sure its important to maintain a certain level of decentralization, but I dont think we are anywhere close to a dangerous situation.

but ya building in some incentives that promote decentralization can't hurt.

Yep, there seems to be some empirical difficulties in the bitcoin space in term of being able to measure exactly the mining and who are the miners, etc, etc.

It seems to be kind of like a catch 22 in that it is difficult to measure exactly who are all the miners and to ensure that some of them are not collaborating in order to destroy bitcoin.

we do have this :https://blockchain.info/pools
we know that the bigger minning pools are each owned/governed by a dozen investors
the other pools get hashes from ~100 large minning operation and thousands of hobbyist.
to me this is just fine, better then fine.
anycase too me its a Todd to think that minners would ever do anything other than what they perceive the majority to want, so who cares.

Quote from: JayJuanGee on July 25, 2016, 09:14:34 PM

Quote from: adamstgBit on July 25, 2016, 08:17:28 PM

I would like to see full-nodes have more weight when it comes to choosing which new features get adopted
they did this thing which allows minning to express there willingness / readiness for any particular BIP.
they should allow full-nodes to do the same thing.

I thought that attempting to accomplish something like this increased the likelihood for sybil attacks, and if so, how can you weight the votes properly if some rich folks are out their trying to imitate nodes as if they are real people?

I guess so, we did see Classic node count reach almost 50% when clearly it never actually had that much support. it was pretty easy to see that they were mostly ran by amazon severs.
maybe they could require nodes to sign a msg with a private key, that way its more clear that we are measuring econmic majority.

Quote from: JayJuanGee on July 25, 2016, 09:14:34 PM

Quote from: adamstgBit on July 25, 2016, 08:17:28 PM

i guess its already like that, i could choose to run BitcoinUnlimited, and there by express my willingness to accept bigger blocks. but idk I just dont FEEL it would make any difference.

Probably in the current state it may not make a lot of difference to run BU. Probably, more effectively would be figuring out ways that maybe some other cryptos are able to better allow for governance and or input to be more balanced and to figure out ways in which to incorporate some of those mechanisms into bitcoin in order that, for example, too much centralization ends up taking over bitcoin.

Some of this will likely evolve with time and monitoring, and surely we continue to hope for decent developments, including issues in which prices are controlled by quasi-centralized exchanges, and maybe there are continuing solutions being proposed to make more decentralized abilities/mechanisms to establish BTC prices.

i think what needs to change is people's perception.

despite SOME people's attempts at spreading the idea that having multiple competing implementations was a good thing. Most still have this idea that if the node isn't a core node its not valid, the idea that the other implementations like BU are written by amateurs and aren't a serious option. things like Mods declaring Classic or BU as an "altcoin" and going on a censorship rampage has fucked with poeple's perception.... shame on them.

I remember a time when all development decisions where carried out by 1 guy rageless of any objections, minners didnt ask questions, users were blissfully unaware of what was included in new versions, while Mr Manipulator (Pirate40 was his name) painted whatever candles sticks he felt was appropriate.
can't say things aren't improving with time, to me bitcoin has never been more decentralized as it is today.