Quote from: pakage on September 12, 2016, 11:01:36 AM

Quote from: jimmco on September 12, 2016, 09:49:52 AM

Quote from: pakage on September 12, 2016, 08:46:40 AM

Quote from: jimmco on September 12, 2016, 08:18:58 AM

Can someone tell me why NAV is better than ShadowProject? Thank you.

Please see this post:

Quote from: pakage on September 02, 2016, 02:56:30 AM

Quote from: domtasc3 on September 01, 2016, 11:47:39 PM

I have invested a pretty substantial amount of Bitcoin into NAV. Seems like it has a great community, and very active devs.... But, I'm starting to wonder if I've made a mistake. What features does NAV have that others don't? There are other anonymous coins. What features will NAV have that others won't? People seem to shy away from inflationary coins. Why go that route? Please help me feel comfortable with my NAV holdings. Again, I love how active the community and Devs are, but I still worry.

I think its a matter of different approaches to anonymous transactions. We use a secondary block chain called a "Subchain" to direct and manage our anonymous transactions as they are encrypted, randomised and routed through the Anonymous Network. This approach is unique to Nav Coin and it has some inherent benefits, the primary one being its resilience. The system runs purely off two block chains, not relying on a database or any extra data storage to mark transactions as "waiting to process" or "processed". This means if our anonymous servers were blocked / deleted / taken down / destroyed or whatever, we could simply start up a new server somewhere else, restore the wallet.dat files and the servers would resume processing transactions without loss and without needing to worry about backing anything else up apart from the wallet.dat files.

Secondly, because we use two block chains, we are able to break the transaction chain between sender and receiver. We have a pool of NAV waiting to be sent on the outgoing server, which can be sent as soon as the outgoing server receives the instruction from the subchain. It doesnt have to wait for the real NAV to arrive because of the nature of how block chains work and the way the server is coded, we can trust the amounts recorded to the subchain as correct and send the amount of NAV from the pool before the sent NAV arrive. This means the NAV recieved are not able to be traced back to the NAV which were sent no matter how hard you look at the NAV block chain.

Third, we are coming fast to the point where we can decentralise the anonymous network and allow other users to setup their own processing servers. When this happens, users will be able to earn NAV for processing transactions and we will become the first fully decentralised, double encrypted, anonymous system running purely off block chain tech! Wow, what a mouthful!

So that's the technology, lets talk about features.

We are working towards being the first anonymous crypto which can send anon transactions from the mobile wallet. That will be massive. As well as anonymous merchant integrations, the raspberry pi staking unit and a few other things currently on our road map: http://www.navcoin.org/projects

Even if you were just to consider us to have the same features as DASH or XMR, then that still makes us hugely undervalued by at least 10x - 100x

By the way, i think the other anon coins are great and you should definitely look into them. See if they fit your needs and if the technology fits your ideals. Having multiple options in the financial privacy sector of cryptocurrencies is definitely a good thing. If there was just one, then firstly there is no competition to innovate and secondly it becomes a single point of failure. We offer a secure alternative, based on different technology served in a way which we believe is the best approach. We are part of the array of tools you can use to protect your financial privacy on the internet and we support the efforts of all the other anon coins.

That's my 2c anyway

Thank you, it's definitely interesting and project has quite a drive although I'll have to read it again, first point doesn't make much sense to me as I think in any blockchain you can just easily add/replace nodes. Second point is probably clear to me - mixing with two blockchains will confuse tracking even more, that makes sense. And third point I don't get it. It's quite common that you can add your own servers (nodes) into network, so what's so special here? Maybe it's reffering something like Dash Master Nodes.

One more specific thing when I was trying NAV - http://www.navcoin.org/downloads offers you Linux Wallet Download but redirect you only to source code. That's not nice. People mostly don't wish to build anything they want just try. Especially when often there are building issues when you don't have reference OS. Would be nice to provide builds.

1) Yes, but if we're talking about a system which truly disconnects sender from receiver there needs to be some data store in the middle between the incoming and outgoing node other wise all transactions could just be traced back to sender (eventually) through the main blockchain. A common way to manage data for reading between two servers is a traditional database, something like MySQL. If you used a common database to be the middleman between incoming and outgoing nodes, then you leave yourself open to all sorts of known vulnerabilities. All someone would have to do is figure out how to inject some rows into the database and they could make your outgoing server send coins to them. Thus you would have departed from the vast majority of benefits of using blockchains in the first place. We get around this problem by using an encrypted subchain as this data store which both servers can read. As you know, blockchains are immutable and it is very difficult to fake records, plus they're fully restorable.

2) Great, glad you understand

3) Anyone who has the full node NAV client can be a part of the NAV network. But up until now, the only people who have the subchain and also the code which processes the anonymous transactions have been us. We have kept it private and offered a set of servers which were open to the public for anonymizing transactions. This will be how the new setup first launches, after that, we will create a distributable version of the anonymous transaction processing code which any user (with some crypto and linux knowledge) will be able to configure, run and process anon transactions with which will earn them the 0.5% processing fee.

Make sense?

Feel free to ask any more questions you may have.

Cheers,
Craig.

Thanks, it makes sense and I believe I see the points. In general, it proves that NAV takes anonymization very seriously. To me, NAV 1.0 anonymity provided was probably more than enough. When I see how difficult is hunting bitcoin thieves I'm wondering if we really need that complex anonymity model. But yeah, if you wish to eliminate all the traces you need stuff like this.