Quote from: PachucoBro on April 05, 2013, 12:55:15 AM

Quote from: mitty on April 05, 2013, 12:29:04 AM

Yes- the ASIC chip is fundamental difference between ASIC mining hardware and every other type of mining hardware. These are custom chips designed specifically for bitcoin mining and aren't available anywhere else. The rest of the stuff (circuit boards, controllers, etc.) are just common parts available to everyone. (or parts that can be designed and manufactured relatively easily for a low cost, e.g. printed circuit boards)

Thanks for the well written response... so after searching some of the terms you mention and other searches regarding manufacturing ASICs... I am better informed of what you said about the chip being the hinge point.

No problem; your question was very valid and relevant considering the extreme demand of ASIC-based bitcoin miners. Wink

Quote

To me it would have been a better approach for someone like BFL and Avalon to work together on making the CHIP and then create products around that chip. I'm sure there are some differences in the firmware and hardware that would differentiate the various makers of BitCoin mining ASICs who would then pay a per unit price for use of the chip that incorporates the design costs etc.

I think BFL actually outsourced their ASIC design which was probably one of the factors that led them to the trouble they're in now. It seems like BFL figured that they'd just pay someone else to deliver ASIC chips and then only deal with building the chips into a consumer product.
On the other hand I think Avalon did both their chip design and product integration in-house, and I'm sure them being in China (geographically close to chip manufacturers) helped a lot as well.
The BFL miners look like the iPods of bitcoin while the Avalon miner looks more like your "jumper wires and shoeboxes" project... except the Avalon actually exists and has been shipping almost according to schedule since the beginning of February, while BFL finally released a significantly-under-spec prototype 6 months after they said they'd be shipping to consumers.
Back to the topic: Outsourcing can apparently have negative impacts. :p

**note: I didn't confirm any of the above. It's what I'm assuming/might have read somewhere else on these forums. So take it with a grain of salt since it may not be 100% correct.

Quote

I worry that after all these ASICs come out that they didn't get it 'right' and they don't perform like they should and have to go back to the drawing board incurring more costs the companies can't swallow. *ahem* BFL Roll Eyes

Basically yeah; I think it can cost 10s of thousands of dollars (or more) to re-work an ASIC design once the chips have already started being fabricated. That's why it's important to test extensively before sending a design off to be manufactured.

Either way the difficulty comes from finding the right people to design the chips, and having the money to fabricate the chips. You can solve both of these with money but it's a very significant amount of money, and those who can do it cheaper (i.e. Avalon, ASICMINER) will probably come out ahead.