Quote from: AlphaWolf on April 19, 2013, 01:37:10 AM

Quote from: agentbluescreen on April 19, 2013, 01:13:51 AM

Quote from: AlphaWolf on April 19, 2013, 12:28:46 AM

Gold/fiat do have one advantage over bitcoin... you can still trade with them when the lights go out. Don't get me wrong, I think Bitcoin is superior in many ways... but imagine a world that trades exclusively in Bitcoin, and then imagine an EMP strike anywhere. We are close to this being an issue already with fiat being exchanged almost exclusively electronically, of course. I believe the smart course of action is "diversify".

There is also nothing that "backs" gold, it can be easily counterfeited (plated tungsten) and it too, even like oil, began it's path to becoming a symbol of wealth as a "pyramid scheme". The Bilderberg Gold Pharaohs of Liechtenstein still wield their monopoly over it as their fiat authority to own and enslave us all and our nations though the mechanisms of their exclusive proprietary ownerships of our national mediums of labour exchange currencies today. When the "lights go out" fuels, ammunition, weapons and food will all have far more value than gold.

A Bitcoin is simply a derivative that only represents the LOOT or SERVICES that the guy that you got it off, got out of you for it, and made off with. It is a fiat "futures derivative contract" that arguably has some but really has no certain inherent added-value, other than as a virtual digital sort of an encrypted GM ignition key, that you can move, swap and store electronically.

Like a "gold contract' or "mortgage backed security' (I love that last word) derivative it is a "BTC -securitized Future Derivative Contract" that merely allows you to keep, transfer it around or transfer it somewhere else to resell it there for whatever it may seem to be worth to the next guy, a minimum of an hour from now.

The suicidal crisis with Fiat Bitcoins is that there is no convention nor systematic mechanism of well-regulation to stabilize nor assure users the stable Fiat "value" of them, relative to anything else practical. These means that they are doomed to being a totally unsuitable, unreliable, non dependable and useless Medium of Labour Exchange Currency.

I said nothing about gold being "backed" or that it couldn't be counterfeited. I said it had one advantage over Bitcoin (no more, no less)... It can be traded when there is no power. No power doesn't have to equate to anarchy or some post-apocalyptic world you saw in a movie. It can be simply "the power went out, and will be out for the next X days". Even in your post-apocalyptic world, people will still want to trade in a currency -- the relative value of that currency to other commodities is irrelevant. So what if gold is less valuable than food? If I have food to trade, and you have fuel that I don't need, then we're going to have a tough time trading. I can carry more "value" of gold than I can gallons of fuel... unless fuel *becomes* the new "gold" (it's value "density" being quite high). That's the problem that currency solves. That is not a problem that Bitcoin can currently solve unless one has both electricity and working connection to the network. The rest of your ramblings are irrelevant.

The rest of my "ramblings" were with regard to the subject of this discussion:

Do Bitcoins need something REAL to back them?

not to do with the "ramblings" of yours. Cheesy

The relatively assured stable value over time of a Medium of Labour Exchange Currency is it's most critically important and indispensable feature, eclipsing even it's portability and immunity to counterfeiting!

In Economics, Labour alone is the Prime Commodity-Resource, without it, nothing happens, period!

It doesn't matter if it's scratching a nose at an auction, hitting a key, doing a heart transplant, changing a tire, wiring a house, curing a disease, buying or selling a share, paying a bill, inventing a Bitcoin or taking out the garbage.

The Prime Commodity Resource of the Fruits of all Labours is the hopefully ever-expanding (growing) Wealths of all Nations. The wealth of a nation's exports is what "backs" the "relative to other currencies" day to day value of it's people's Labour Exchange "currency" in the global marketplace.

Finite, precious resources like fine art, antiques, collectables and to a lesser extent second rate finite commodity resources like platinum, gold, gems and other generic junk are "deflationary" Mediums of Savings simply because they are finite as the fruits of all labours cannot be.

All other commodity resources are mere Mediums of Investment that can go up or down like toilet seats depending on a myriad of esoteric elements of technological chance, adaptations or happenstance.

No contractor, entrepreneur not merchant can price a contract to do anything or hire others to do them in an unstable supposed "Medium of Labour Exchange Currency" that may be $80 one day $100 the next, $260 the next and then $50 two hours after that, nor one that changes 15%-70% of it's value any time of any day like a toilet seat.

Nobody could risk the time it takes to get or spend it.

BTW gold and oil have had a totally consistent relative value to one another for a hundred years, and you cannot really trade gold unless you have a battery operated drill and assaying equipment.