Quote from: Tmdz on June 26, 2017, 10:09:47 PM

Quote from: Monayman on June 26, 2017, 09:21:16 PM

Quote from: tomfullery on June 26, 2017, 07:40:35 PM

I've been watching crypto markets for a good 5 years now and made the bulk of my investment within this past year and just recently got my first (and last) rig up and running.

My opinion is that the whole thing is just a continuous pump and dump. Its no different than a ponzi scheme where you require a greater fool to buy at a higher price from you. you have new dumb money getting sold on $5k-$100k bitcoin prices from hype and idiot memes, spending their paychecks on coinbase market buys as well as pure gambling on shitcoins while whales cash out to from these greater fools in predictable intervals. That's like the only pattern there is. It's just been exacerbated as of recently due to btc soft fork FUD and ETH ICOs cashing out the moment fundraising is over...they dont give a sh#t and the price tanking reflects that.

We should be really worried how all crypto coins are tied to btc price and how there's really no way to evaluate the worth of these coins via fundamental analysis.

I'll be bagholding for a good year i predict.

I do agree that the entire crypto world is very susceptible to pumps and dumps.
But in my humble opinion, that is a only a symptom of the low market value of the entire crypto market now - it is simply too cheap not to manipulate.
If you have been following the markets for that long, then I think you'll have noticed that the volatility of cryptos, while still insane when compared to high cap stocks, is far lower than it used to be ...

That makes it both extremely interesting and extremely risky to "invest" in. It is in fact more of a gamble than anything at this point to put any money anywhere near anything that has to do with crypto.

What makes me so bullish about the future value of BTC (or other cryptos), is that we have only begun scratching the surface of what the tech could be used for - from supplying underbanked masses with a means to store funds electronically, through (more useful nowadays) being used as a means to move around obscene amounts of money without requiring banks... If you wanted to move millions of dollars from one country to the next a few years ago, you'd have to stash your luggage with cash and hope that customs won't take a peek ... now it could be stored in a memorized private key, in the form of a currency that is liquid enough to convert to insane amounts of fiat in no time flat in most places in the world.

As to the possibility of "losing" money vs fiat value in BTC, due to volatility, I actually think the risk is manageable over short periods of time.
Ask Canadians how much buying power they lost over the last two years because of the insane decline of the Canadian dollar, or many Europeans got screwed because they pulled out loans in Swiss francs ... or how much was lost by people holding British pounds in the last year!

I do get that BTC is a very fringe-ey tech, but its uses and potential are very, very real.
Can it tank and become worthless? Sure.
But I just don't see that happening.
So bag holding is the way to go. And not even for a year - hold it until that shit can secure your retirement, or busts entirely.
That's my game. And if I lose everything I've ever put into it? Bah, it's money I never had anyways Wink

+1

Bitcoin is a solid holding, it is finally getting a scaling improvement. Long term it will be BIG, I mean 10 years down the line 2 or 3 btc will fund your retirement. Some other coins are good to be in as well, just any solid crypto portfolio.

Now look at Berkshire Hathaway

Opened in 1991 with about 1.6 million shares and market cap of ~11 billion for a stock price of $7100
Lets say you didn't buy in until 1995 4 year later which put it around btc current cap of ~30 billion @ $20'000 a share and you buy a single share.
Tons of volatility from 1995 to 2017 with big declines where lots of people bailed, but you hold.

Your $20'000 invest is worth $251'000 and growing.
That means the market cap doubled 13.7 times
You made $230'000

Now How many times can bitcoin or other solid coins double in price over ~10-20 years?
It did this year, how about next year and future halvings?

Exponential growth is some crazy shit.

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Edit I forgot about inflation.

The starting $20'000 would only be $32,500 by todays numbers.

Interestingly, I haven't calculated the returns on my Canadian investments vis à vis foreign currencies.
But suppose I had invested the same amount in Canadian GIC's 5 years ago as I did in my old mining equipment, corrected for current value against the USD, then even if I include the tax breaks offered by our govt for retirement funds (to be taxed upon withdrawal, of course), then I'd still be eons behind what I have made on cryptos. Shit, my investments made way more than that, and they still fell 30% vs the USD in the last two years 😪
In a funny way, even after years of neglect, crypto has protected me from forex fluctuations.
Hell, if BTC went down to 500 USD I'd still be in my money