Quote from: markus fuchs on October 28, 2017, 11:41:24 AM

Quote from: Hiaco Taki on October 24, 2017, 09:11:58 AM

I have investes in two other ICO's relating to Binary Options. And I have regretted this very much. These binary ICO's are popping up every day. Newest I think binary.com
So after investing I looked (to late) into this business and the potential.

THIS SPECTRE PLATFORM WILL NEVER WORK !! (of course they do not care, only if the ICO works)

1. They say they will apply for a EU license
The 1st of January MIFID II will get in effect, meaning 95% of all EU countries will ban Binary Options. So this license is worthless. It can only be used in the EU.
US, Canada, Brasil and many other countries and continents have already stated that offering Binary options is illegal. Binary Options are dead !
>> clearly no real research was done or ignored

2. Financial statement is total guess work (or just pumped up for this ICO)
All other Binary ICO companies have set out income and cost of running a binary platform.
Running such a platform cost a lot of money (especially marketing) and this all going to be paid for with a 2% margin , get real !
They state a client value of 2500, this is absurd. Not even the largest Forex brokers have such a value. Traders putting 8 trades every day ?? They do not go on holliday or take a break or stop trading...?
>> this team has no experience and is making up numbers

3. NO CONFLICTOF INTEREST ??
Spectre is no broker, but it sure as hell is a counter party of their traders! Traders loose and the company wins.
If clients win, this Holy Grale (the liquidity pool) is going to get empty and this means no income for the company (or token holders) , so what is keeping them from rigging the platform ?

They say all brokers are scammers (which is true). But where do they get this winrate of 52% (needed for them to make a profit). This company has no experience in running a binary company, so these numbers come from other brokers (correct: scam brokers) And why is the win rate so low, because if the broker does not scam, the winrate will be much higher!

4. Make a choice , token holders or traders !
Spectre is promoting the platform to traders and pretending that they will offer all the tools to be a successful trader. This is great ! For the traders, but not for the shareholders (clients need to loose to make money)
On the other side they promote ICO investors that they are going to offer a profitable trading platform, in which clients will loose on average 2500 ..

So What is it ?

What is your goal, make us rich or make traders rich !
the only way both parties can profit if you are a REAL BROKER. A real broker earns on commissions, which means the more positions a traders opens the more commission you earn as a company and now you want the trader to win, as you will want him to place more trades Wink

Great company to set out an ICO and not saying it is a scam, but they have no idea what they are doing and have no experience. (look at the team) and this platform will go bust on traders winning (thats what you want, right? )

Reading this thread carefully, and besides all the sales pitches from Spectre and other members (part of Spectres team or not) This were some valid questions, still not one single answer to one of them from Spectre. Besides some cursing from idiots.
What I do know is that Binary is illegal in most countries and more countries are joining every day. And the EU countries will also make it illegal. You can read about this all over the internet.

So I think it is stepping in a industry that is coming to its end...

Hi, you were already responded to here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2169122.msg23474749#msg23474749

I will copy/paste it here for those who missed it (including you):

I have investes in two other ICO's relating to Binary Options. And I have regretted this very much. These binary ICO's are popping up every day. Newest I think binary.com
So after investing I looked (to late) into this business and the potential.

You havent read our whitepaper so if possible, try and stop ranting and carefully read our responses. Binary.com is a centralised Binary broker raising money to continue their existing model and tokenise end of year profits to dividends. Ours removes the broker completely out of the equation and replaces them with a decentralised, autonomous liquidity pool (DALP) and P2P model. This allows traders to trade a range of digital options, smart CFDs and traditional a-book trading. Not sure what makes you believe we are a binary broker there are no deposits on our platform and no broker present. We dont offer binary options. The nature of our contracts covers binary outcomes as well, however these are Smart Options and Smart CFDs (ULC) and other contract types. Everything is governed by smart contracts which is the big difference which you clearly have missed.

THIS SPECTRE PLATFORM WILL NEVER WORK !! (of course they do not care, only if the ICO works)

It already works. The pool has grown, traders love it. Defamatory statements that are misleading will result in you being tracked down and sued for defamation. We are happy to escalate this.

1. They say they will apply for a EU license The 1st of January MIFID II will get in effect, meaning 95% of all EU countries will ban Binary Options. So this license is worthless. It can only be used in the EU. US, Canada, Brasil and many other countries and continents have already stated that offering Binary options is illegal. Binary Options are dead !>> clearly no real research was done or ignored

We have actually met with regulators including CySEC. Clearly your understanding of MIFID 2 is lacking as MIFID 2 is not actually even published. MIFID 2 doesnt ban binary options. There is no information on that. Binary Options are not allowed to be marketed in select regions like Canada or Israel. However, as you can see digital options are big in the U.S as traded under CFTC regulated NADEX who has no plans to ban them. Binary.com which operates under a gaming license in Malta is actually one of the market leaders and will they be shut down by MIFID 2? Absolutely not. Is IQ Option being shut down by CySEC? They are one of the biggest binary players in Europe and operating well within the law. Again, we offer Smart Options (both all or nothing and digital options however our contracts are governed by smart contracts on the Ethereum blockchain, so there is no opportunity for financial fraud) and CFDs and traditional A-Book trading. You have clearly misunderstood what Spectre.ai does.

2. Financial statement is total guess work (or just pumped up for this ICO)
All other Binary ICO companies have set out income and cost of running a binary platform.
Running such a platform cost a lot of money (especially marketing) and this all going to be paid for with a 2% margin , get real !

Actually our 2% model on SOs and 2-20% of spread on CFDs works like a charm. It more than covers our cost base (we dont have account managers like you do at the broker you work for) so our human-asset intensity is far lower. Also dont forget we hold d tokens that participate in volumes not only on the normal divvy but end of year special divvy as well. That flows through as operating income. Were a tech company, not a financial broker. Ergo, our cost base mirrors the former, not latter. Login to our platform and you can see the total dividends paid out, growth in the liquidity pool since the alpha went live around 1.5 months is over 5k ethers, which validates all of our forecasts. Our win rate assumptions included. We have the data, not sure what youre operating on.

They state a client value of 2500, this is absurd. Not even the largest Forex brokers have such a value. Traders putting 8 trades every day ?? They do not go on holliday or take a break or stop trading...?
>> this team has no experience and is making up numbers

Again, as you havent read our white paper or gone into our detailed Forecasts model, you are not in a position to speak with any real authority. Nowhere is the LTV stated as $2,500. It is at $800-900 (page 14 Whitepaper), go to our Forecasts model as well and look at cell B72. With regards to holidays and breaks, yes actually we do factor that in, look at cell number B71. It assumes 110 days of trading (which is based on actual FX and DO data). So everything you have categorically said is false and misleading. Now yes, if you divide Gross Revs by the number of traders you get a net-volume per trader of around $2.4k (aka gross-ltv) however the LTV to us and token holders (net-ltv) is far lower owing to the mechanics of the DALP. Additionally, the LTV for FX traders is far higher than BO traders and our forecasts include a blend of both types of traders not depleted binary option traders. Many European FX brokerages have client LTVs of EUR 3,000 +. Some are at EUR 1,800 but the average is way higher. Most importantly, our data and assumptions on both net-LTVs and gross-LTVs are coming from one of the market leaders in Europe in binaries (volumes, win-rates, everything) so we have actual data verification behind our assumptions.

3. NO CONFLICTOF INTEREST ??
Spectre is no broker, but it sure as hell is a counter party of their traders! Traders loose and the company wins.
If clients win, this Holy Grale (the liquidity pool) is going to get empty and this means no income for the company (or token holders) , so what is keeping them from rigging the platform ?

Based on this question it is clear that you dont understand how the Ethereum block chain works, nor how immutable smart contracts interface with multi-sig wallets. We are not a counterparty to anything. Trader trade p2p or against the DALP. The Ethereum blockchain guarantees orcalised pricing so truer and fairer entries and only smart contracts control fund flows (not humans) after trade outcomes (wins, losses, close TP/SLs). It is theoretically impossible for us to extract funds from the liquidity pool (DALP). The only way spectre.ais wallet and d token holder wallets get paid are through volumes (not just losses; we are agnostic whether the client wins or loses). Again, loosely glancing over our whitepaper but not actually understanding what we do is going to result in false conclusions.

They say all brokers are scammers (which is true). But where do they get this winrate of 52% (needed for them to make a profit). This company has no experience in running a binary company, so these numbers come from other brokers (correct: scam brokers) And why is the win rate so low, because if the broker does not scam, the winrate will be much higher!

The win rate is actually 49.8% on binary options and we have this from one of the market leaders in Europe with trade data totalling over thousands trades and thousands of customers (sign an NDA with us and we can release that information in confidence, no problem). We build in a higher win-rate on our platform (52%) because our trading platform actually has good risk management features and emotion control algorithms that ensure clients dont destroy their account within weeks of depositing. Our current win-rate on the spectre.ai dapp which has seen millions in volume go through it already is tracking close to 52-54%.

4. Make a choice , token holders or traders !
Spectre is promoting the platform to traders and pretending that they will offer all the tools to be a successful trader. This is great ! For the traders, but not for the shareholders (clients need to loose to make money) On the other side they promote ICO investors that they are going to offer a profitable trading platform, in which clients will loose on average 2500 ..

Again, as you havent read our white paper or gone into our detailed Forecasts model, you are not in a position to speak with any real authority. Nowhere is the LTV stated as $2,500. It is at $800-900 (page 14 Whitepaper), go to our Forecasts model as well and look at cell B72. With regards to holidays and breaks, yes actually we do factor that in, look at cell number B71. It assumes 110 days of trading (which is based on actual FX and DO data). So everything you have categorically said is false and misleading. Now yes, if you divide Gross Revs by the number of traders you get a net-volume per trader of around $2.4k (aka gross-ltv) however the LTV to us and token holders (net-ltv) is far lower owing to the mechanics of the DALP. Additionally, the LTV for FX traders is far higher than BO traders and our forecasts include a blend of both types of traders not depleted binary option traders. Many European FX brokerages have client LTVs of EUR 3,000 +. Some are at EUR 1,800 but the average is way higher. Most importantly, our data and assumptions on both net-LTVs and gross-LTVs are coming from one of the market leaders in Europe in binaries (volumes, win-rates, everything) so we have actual data verification behind our assumptions.

Whether you like it or not, take a look at Oandas latest audited reports, 65-70% of traders even in a safe a-book environment lose money. Its that simple. Of course the traders that are good and deserve to win should get paid and thats exactly what we create a true and fair trading environment.

Also with regards to trading profits as a percentage of total Spectre.ai and token holder revenues, you have completely misunderstood how the Dapp store works and what adjacent fin-tech sectors/areas the DALP will connect to thus diversifying revenue streams.

So What is it ?What is your goal, make us rich or make traders rich !

To create the fairest and most transparent trading environment. Our technology means no deposits required, no brokers required, all prices independently verified. Those who win get paid, shareholders and Spectre.ai get paid on volumes (not just losses but both wins and losses) and Dapp store growth. Speaking in exclamation marks and screaming is not going to change our mission.

the only way both parties can profit if you are a REAL BROKER. A real broker earns on commissions, which means the more positions a traders opens the more commission you earn as a company and now you want the trader to win, as you will want him to place more trades Wink
Great company to set out an ICO and not saying it is a scam, but they have no idea what they are doing and have no experience. (look at the team) and this platform will go bust on traders winning (thats what you want, right? )

This is what a real broker does: https://www.timesofisrael.com/fleeced-by-israeli-binary-options-firm-canadian-man-commits-suicide/

People like you belong behind bars guising as customers when actually you are a broker yourself. Had you made that clear earlier, it would make a lot more sense that you had a dog in the fight. We mean this in every professional sense; shame on you for being a broker and part of the problem and trying to attack a technology that actually creates a fair and transparent trading environment for traders. Read the whitepaper.

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