Quote from: gill83 on June 24, 2013, 05:30:51 AM

Quote from: Vycid on June 24, 2013, 05:28:58 AM

Quote from: gill83 on June 24, 2013, 05:23:42 AM

Quote from: Vycid on June 24, 2013, 05:20:19 AM

Quote from: gill83 on June 24, 2013, 05:18:37 AM

Quote from: BitSyncom on June 24, 2013, 04:12:10 AM

Quote from: Vycid on June 24, 2013, 03:52:54 AM

Quote from: BitSyncom on June 24, 2013, 02:16:55 AM

Quote from: gill83 on June 24, 2013, 02:05:06 AM

Quote from: jspielberg on June 23, 2013, 07:44:43 PM

If anyone doesn't like Bitsyncom's terms, it looks like contrary to their original messaging, they are allowing full refunds.
You just need to create a support ticket and put "REFUND" as the type of the ticket.

So far as I know... no one has taken them up on this offer even though some folks have been complaining about the shipment delays for months.

If you are feeling like you need to hedge... you can order the batch of chips and hope they arrive together.

If they don't arrive in your "window" of opportunity, submit a refund request.
Worst case, they either give back your BTC, or they escalate your order.... my guess would be the former.

I guess worst worst case is they don't ship your chips and they don't refund your BTC... but I don't think they could withstand the negative fallout of that option.
Just make sure to order from a wallet you control and can validate.

Has anyone ever requested and got back a refund from Avalon?

we opened refunding option for batch #3 order since it is quite delayed, batch 2 is shipping and should be finished shipping in the end of the month, then batch #3 is to start right after, we are not refunding chip orders since the coins gets sold and is used to pay for chip order at foundry, canceling is not really possible.

but essentially we put in order for chips every week, by early July the chips that were ordered when we opened orders should be out the door by then.

Yifu... that is provably untrue. Not a single coin paid into the wallet that received payment for chip orders (782.1 BTC per 10,000 chips) has been moved, let alone sold.

http://blockchain.info/address/1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU?offset=0&filter=0

I want to give you the benefit of the doubt here, but the information suggests otherwise.

I addressed this awhile ago, who says that address is ours to begin with?

Yifu, you are plain bullshitting now. If you don't control this address then who does? I have set up a Wordpress + WooCommerce + Bitcoin ecommerce store for a friend. And I know exactly how it works. You enter an end address where all the Bitcoins go. The store generates a temporary address for every transaction and moves the BTC from that temp address to the end address. All the transactions in the above-mentioned transaction log depict this particular behavior. A transaction with BTC coming from multiple addresses into one temp address, and then another transaction moving all that money from that temp address to your address.

Please cook up a more legitimate story if you want to fool us.

If they wanted to fool us they could just move the coins around a whole bunch.

That's what I am saying, he is not doing a good job of fooling us. But he is definitely trying.

No, he is clearly not. People have been asking about those coins for over a month now (should have realized this myself) - he could simply have moved them around and said "we just sold them", and we would have had no evidence to the contrary. But he didn't, resulting in people like you crying foul.

This is the guy that got the first functional Bitcoin ASIC to market. You don't think he knows how to launder bitcoins?

Any legitimate business would refund "pre-orders". Actually, any legitimate business would even return stuff that has been shipped. All I am asking is why can't he refund a pre-order. It's not that he wont be able to sell those chips.

You can say that legitimate businesses would have a refund policy, but not having a refund policy is not illegal (as long as the promised goods are delivered), and it is clear that the money is needed to actually manufacture the goods, so a refund policy would not be practical regardless of how legitimate the business is.