Quote from: togoshigekata on December 21, 2017, 05:53:36 PM

Quote from: jaapgvk on December 21, 2017, 03:07:27 PM

Quote from: seeksilence1 on December 21, 2017, 02:55:03 PM

The previous work should be rewarded. But you need to figure out a reasonable amount. It may take 10 hours for you to do that work. But it may take other 1 hour to do the same work. It depends on the experience and how your proposal can convince other people.

Also, we all benefit from the price increase recently.

@Rob and Togo. You've made some really valid points here. And I agree that I don't want to bog down progress by taking a 'bureaucratic route'. But I also don't want people turning sour because they don't get payed after putting in many hours in a side-project that just isn't 'it' for Biblepay.

And I'd like to add that I haven't voted 'no' on any of the proposals yet (including nananaminers), I just voted 'yes' on the ones I absolutely agree with. For the rest of the proposals, I'd rather have a dialogue about pro's and con's before commiting. But as I said: you've made some excellent points, and I really like your spirit Togo, and I absolutely see the value you have added to this project.

Seekselince1's point was also in the back of my mind. I just want this project to get the right exposure and development, and for that, we need the right people in the right place. And I'm trying to determine what that means, that's all

I totally understand yalls viewpoints and concerns, I share the same, and I hope our different perspectives/beliefs/experiences will balance each other out

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In hindsight I was kind of "bad" and didnt leave my proposals open for discussion before submitting them,
for any future proposals I will try to leave them open for at least a week or two.

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> "I also don't want people turning sour because they don't get payed after putting in many hours in a side-project that just isn't 'it' for Biblepay."

If the person takes the risk of doing something that may not be approved, thats on them, Im okay with it,
and if we don't want to pay them or pay them less for their work because it is lower quality work or not worth what they proposed, than that is what we should do.
Its up to each person to decide how much risk they want to take. And its up to Sanctuary owners to decide what is worth what, what should be approved, what should be prioritized.

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Quote from: 616westwarmoth on December 21, 2017, 05:03:24 PM

Again, this is not a knock on anyone. But people volunteered their skills to make this coin a success. I am a little if-fy on a few parts of one of Togo's proposals, but since he's shown to be such a vital asset to the community with his PR activities I think he needs rewarded. Writing a script to install, which was likely based on Togo's guide? Good but I don't really see that as such monumental contribution (although I have yet to vote on it and will likely vote yes). And this is coming from me, I spent nearly $450 on the logo contest and got donations worth about half that. I haven't made a bit deal about that because, again, it was done prior to their being a budget and done with the knowledge that it was how "I could help" the coin.

In general, I feel that work done prior to budgets should have been done with the understanding it was for the community. I would feel a lot different if the script was submitted to the main branch and added to the main branch. But I also have to applaud the user for doing something for the community and more importantly, not being the one to complain or criticize the community for not saying yes. That's probably the main reason I will vote yes on a proposal I am undecided about, has the user been valuable to the community? Do I want to encourage future value from them?

I agree with Togo's point of work that work done in advance is in many cases ideal (since motivation or opportunity strikes at odd times, and if the work is done, there's no chance the proposal won't be followed up with). However, I would say if it's not time sensitive, asking before doing would be preferred in my book.

On the subject of abstain, I've done that on a few proposals. To me it's a sign that yes, I read and just couldn't decide how to vote, versus the chance a non-vote would be seen as apathy.

616west I think you should be rewarded for the logo contest! This is your chance now!,
I would vote right away for a proposal for you to be back paid on the cost plus work you did based on a way lower BBP price, you deserve it!
I wasnt a fan of the logo the first week but its really grown on me and makes us look very professional.

There is still 200k+ BBP not requested for yet in the P2P fund
(EDIT: I spoke too soon, masternodes.online proposal will potentially eat up the remaining of that, there is still 600k in the PR fund, I would totally vote to use some of the PR fund for the logo since we have no PR people (yet)[I believe April might be writing up a PR proposal, I didnt want to speak for her, but she has done cryptocurrency PR for Factom in the past])

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> "In general, I feel that work done prior to budgets should have been done with the understanding it was for the community"'

I disagree with this, I wouldnt have worked as hard if there was not going to be a potential reward,
I would have let others do the "free" work while my coins grow in value from their work while I contribute very little.
And I would have put my time and energy into other side projects.
I had at least somewhat of an expectation that I would be somewhat rewarded, whether that expectation was right or wrong, we shall see LOL.

This is the problem with other coins, they do not have a governance model / budget proposal system,
There is very little to no incentive for anyone to do any work, everyone wants to hold onto their coins.
Most people are profit driven, whether someone thinks its moral/right or not, profits get me going, its what motivates me to work hard.
(If anyone wants to do free work for me I am hiring LOL Wink

)

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> "I am a little if-fy on a few parts of one of Togo's proposals"

If there is anything concerning please let me know! I will do my best to give more details or change things based on feedback.

Just put in the proposal for the listing at Masternodes.online. It's more expensive than .pro but has some good points (the biggest being they accept BBP).

Again, Togo, you've been awesome so I'm not trying to run you down. I more or less just didn't grasp the Bloom proposal to it's fullest.

In the future, can we perhaps open the thread, discuss it for let's say five days and then put it up for vote? I realize that may not always be practical, but that way if person "A" is thinking their work is worth $20/hr, and "B" thinks it's $15, it can be debated before submitting?