Quote from: pereira4 on January 21, 2018, 06:16:44 PM

Quote from: squatter on January 20, 2018, 11:44:46 PM

...

Everything I said still applies, I don't know where you are @squatter but in countries from Europe which is where I am from, basically you are a criminal by default if you can't clearly prove the origin of the funds.

Like I said, your claim is that cash transactions are essentially illegal and that blockchain transaction history is inadequate (even though Bitcoin and altcoins are obviously used to transfer immense value). You should stop using cryptocurrency if that's your position. I'd like to see the statutes in question because you keep making these claims.

If you think that everyone "in Europe" is being treated as a criminal for cashing out of Bitcoin, then you are delusional.

Quote from: pereira4 on January 21, 2018, 06:16:44 PM

So no, you can't put any relevant amount worth of cash into a bank account without receipts that prove it was earned legally. You are delusional if you think you could get away with putting 5 figures worth of cash inside a bank account and not have the IRS equivalent here knocking on your door asking where that came from, and "I just made this from playing in the casino" without any receipts and clear trace back to the origin will not cut it.

Actually, you are completely wrong. Again, I have been doing this for years and I've always consulted competent tax advisors. Qualified accountants, attorneys and the IRS agree that this is how table game income works in the US:

Quote

Casinos are not required to withhold taxes or issue a W2-G to players who win large sums at certain table games, such as blackjack, craps and roulette. It is not entirely clear why the IRS has differentiated the requirements this way; slot machines are games of pure chance, while table games require a level of skill. When you cash in your chips from a table game, the casino cannot determine with certainty how much money you started with.

Even if you do not receive a W2-G or have taxes withheld from blackjack winnings, this does not absolve you of the obligation to report what you won to the IRS. You simply do it yourself when you file your taxes for the year rather than at the casino when you claim your winnings.

Quote from: pereira4 on January 21, 2018, 06:16:44 PM

You can't also put crypto earnings of any kind in an account without having full history of your earnings and being able to trace and report every satoshi movement including the movements inside exchanges.

Says who? Show me the law.

And if that's really the case, then you should read between the lines. The fact that Mintpal (for example) has no records to refute you only works in your favor. It's clear as day that billions of dollars are transacted in cryptocurrencies every day. It's also clear as day that the vast majority of these transactions are not recorded in a way that can be transmitted to tax authorities systematically.

You can either work within that context and pay the taxes you owe, or you can keep complaining about how there is no systematic government-whitelisted approach to doing that. Your choice.

Quote from: pereira4 on January 21, 2018, 06:16:44 PM

About dead exchanges, unless you made a daily backup of your trades, chances are you would be unlucky and not have an updated trading history saved because exchanges die randomly.

That's unfortunate but it's your fault and just indicates that you were never serious about paying your taxes to begin with. As I said, I paid all taxes owed on Mintpal and Cryptsy several years ago.

Fortunately for you, the fact that Mintpal and Cryptsy don't exist to refute your trading records actually works in your favor. There is functionally no difference between Mintpal trading records you fabricate today, and my real trading records from 4 years ago. But you continue to irrationally go on about "every satoshi movement inside exchanges" as if tax authorities could ever determine the truth.

Quote from: pereira4 on January 21, 2018, 06:16:44 PM

It is only fair to be cautious and ask for precedents, and see what authorities would demand if you tried to cash out amounts that come from mixed origin, dead exchange origin, or signature campaign origin. The only clear and easy way is the usual one: buying them in an exchange where you are verified and selling them again: capital gains tax and you present the trades which are done in your name. Everything else is a grey area which im not willing to cross without having clear precedents because I don't want to get my bitcoins counterfeited.

There are no precedents. You might wait years for clarity. This is like the meme of the skeleton waiting for the Bitcoin price to dip.

The cautious move was to consult an accountant/lawyer years ago -- and certainly when tax liabilities for the previous trading year arose. Just because cryptocurrencies are a new asset class doesn't mean you could assume that taxes didn't apply like other assets.

Quote from: pereira4 on January 21, 2018, 06:16:44 PM

Quote

Bitcoins earned from signature campaigns and bounties count as ordinary income and they don't qualify for lower tax rates as capital gains. But then, the most important question is whether we should pay tax on those coins which are still in our wallet or not. Ideally, I would pay taxes only on those coins which I sold for fiat. But if Bitcoin is ordinary income, then we need to pay tax on all our coins, right?

In theory yes, but the problem is, if you've been doing this for years and never reported anything... once you do want to cash out to buy a house, what can one expect?

That means you you didn't treat it as ordinary income, which usually triggers tax liabilities in the tax year you earned it. The honest thing to do is amend your previous tax returns to declare your income from previous years. Alternatively, there are a host of options, but none of them are technically honest nor legal. And since you believe that every satoshi must be accounted for including links to exchanges with KYC, it sounds like you are between a rock and a hard place.