Quote from: smooth on April 17, 2018, 02:08:23 AM

Quote from: Hueristic on April 17, 2018, 12:55:19 AM

Quote from: smooth on April 17, 2018, 12:05:36 AM

2. ASICs increase hash rate security (and therefore coin value) but may reduce it due to reduced miner decentralization, so the effect is ambiguous (and depends on the relevant, and generally unknown, constant factors). Of course, the Monero community is aware of the second consideration, given the recent decision to fork out ASICs, but the ambiguity may be under appreciated. Personally I find it quite troubling and would prefer a way to win on both sides rather than grapple with a potentially intractable tradeoff.

I don't think the bolded can ever be possible. And I venomously disagree with ASICs increasing a coins value I would say quite the opposite. Bitcoin is a one off aberration that it's descendants can never me modeled upon as it's creation, adoption and community are and were all unique. Trying to use it as a model is a fools errand and is oblique to anything that follows.

You may be right. What I would prefer and what may be possible aren't necessarily the same thing.

BTW, my views on this have nothing to do with Bitcoin and I don't even think Bitcoin is a very positive example when it coms to ASICs. For all we know Bitcoin's price could very well be much higher if the mining ecosystem were healthier.

I would most certainly agree with this, but as a side effect It is my opinion that a large portion of that is now in alts and their development (as well as scammers hands). So it's a double edge sword but one that pretty much fuels innovation so in a roundabout way it is good for the scene as a whole that bitcoin eventually be surpassed as long as it is by a superior product and not one the oligarthy pushes down our throat (for control) or some scam like ETH that gets too big to fail. It sickens me to see so many resources go into ETH development and those cronies pocketing fortunes on a mutable chain as if it doesn't matter at all. Thats one thing those with a voice should be touting from up on high.

Quote from: explorer on April 17, 2018, 05:44:35 AM

How many trades did it take to break even?

That is from my entire History! Remember I have bought what I could just to try to help during the BCX Fud and I guess I just got even from that? Actually that is what made me decide to make the plunge in the first place after watching the project for a year. Also I could tell there was something wrong with the miner just by how long it took me to mine and the amount that was being sold. It was my plan to wait for the price to get lower but I hated seeing what just a littel FUD did. Now I know better and don't think as the eco system as being that fragile.

AFA how many trades I have no clue but could count them I guess but thats alot as I've margined alot over the years, Ohh yeah I also got really screwed in an open margin during the BTC split so there was that.

Whats yours?

Quote from: Globb0 on April 17, 2018, 08:41:51 AM

In some ways why is a miner different to say a TV set top box or games console.

Its just a cut down set of technology that does one thing well.

Maybe its really the future of more things.

Evolution of the multifunctional PC to more focused PC types?

Who knows. I know we cant stand still.

It's different as in availability, Mose homes have computers if mot multiple ones. compare that to how much of the worlds population has asics, and there will never be a large portion that does as they continually make the latest version obsolete. Of course so does a home system but at such a slower rate that those systems are EOL by then anyway,