Quote from: St.Bit on November 08, 2013, 03:45:51 PM

Quote from: AnonyMint on November 08, 2013, 02:13:32 PM

How does PoW waste resources?

Securing the network with a technology that has to use lot's of electricity insead of POS that doesn't require any is a good example of wasting resources. It isn't innovative to use a expensive way to do it if you already knew a better one to do it for free.

Walking to work gets you there, but using energy to get you there is much more efficient and leads to more production overall for society. Creating a demand for that use of energy leads to all sorts of new technologies and innovations and causes the economy to expand.

Energy is not a finite resource. The more innovation we do, the more energy we produce.

The only limit of mankind is our knowledge.

Try to lose that Malthusian zero-sum nonsense that mass media has brainwashed into the people.

The elitists want you to believe that nonsense. Refer to the stated goals on Ted Turner's (CNN) Georgia Guidestones.

Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature.
Guide reproduction wisely improving fitness and diversity.
Unite humanity with a living new language.
Rule passion faith tradition and all things with tempered reason.
Protect people and nations with fair laws and just courts.
Let all nations rule internally resolving external disputes in a world court.
Avoid petty laws and useless officials.
Balance personal rights with social duties.
Prize truth beauty love seeking harmony with the infinite.
Be not a cancer on the earth Leave room for nature Leave room for nature.

Quote from: St.Bit on November 08, 2013, 03:45:51 PM

Your argument is invalid, since it basically says it's impossible to waste resources at all.

No.

Waste is where there is no return. Efficiency is output divided by input.

Quote from: St.Bit on November 08, 2013, 03:45:51 PM

Remember we are talking about securing the network, not distributing new coins to anyone willing to work for it. Once blockrewards decline POW won't do that anymore

Debasement should continue forever. It is good for economics and the middle class. I've already had that debate in the Mini-blockchain thread. Refer to it there if you want to refute it. I don't want to repeat that debate again here in this thread. Getting too far off topic.

Quote from: St.Bit on November 08, 2013, 03:45:51 PM

and it's 100% wasteful while POS doesn't cost anything at all.

PoS has a huge cost in laziness and lost innovation.

You are valuing hardware (energy) more than knowledge! Big mistake!

Quote from: St.Bit on November 08, 2013, 03:45:51 PM

When looking at POS you seem to miss the point that there is no new wealth generation.

Correct, there is wealth destruction. But I doubt you see why.

First of all, the laborers (knowledge workers) spend a higher percent of their income and gains and savings, thus they fall behind the rich. Yet the rich can't innovate, because innovation requires small capital and thus fitness. The rich can only replicate. Mass production is coming to an end with the 3D printer.

Secondly, it encourages laziness, which is the epitome of capital destruction. Remember capital is not money, money is a claim on future knowledge production. If you stop producing knowledge, then the capital (the value of the money) declines w.r.t. to knowledge that has utility. The utility of the money declines.

Quote from: St.Bit on November 08, 2013, 03:45:51 PM

If we would add a zero to every dollar bill, bank account,wages, etc nothing would change. Noone would be richer or poorer, in fact nothing changes. Even a 10-fold wouldn't make a difference, so 1% per year isn't even worth mentioning in term of costs.

Don't conflate that with the motivation the system has on the participants.

Quote from: St.Bit on November 08, 2013, 03:45:51 PM

People sending funds loose fees and interrest, but it's these people that need a safe and non reverseable network. Someone holding a wallet doesn't need that once it's in the blockchain. Why should someone else or all pay for them the efford to do the work.

You could try to rewrite this last paragraph so I can understand your point.