Quote from: Vod on November 19, 2013, 09:26:05 PM

The only way you could use the mining hardware as collateral would be if the hardware was kept in the lenders possession until the loan amount was recovered. Then the rigs could be sent to you. Would you be willing to do that?

It might be the 'best way' to use the mining hardware as collateral but it is not the only way. Another way would be that I am honest and could be trusted, but I understand that is an unreasonable thing to expect one to believe under these circumstances. Another way would be to have the hardware hosted by an individual that already has established trust with the community, which is something I already have arranged incase it is needed. A third independent party would be fine with me but the loan provider holding the hardware may not be anymore trustworthy than I (presumably) am. They could easily take payments for a while, then refuse to relinquish the miners and justify doing so by claiming that I didn't live up to my end of the deal. They come out of it looking like a victim while actually leaving me as the one who was taken advantage of. The potential scenarios are endless so why concentrate on only me as being the only on who could possibly be the nefarious one. If you want to protect people from abuse you need to consider both sides equally.

And besides this, I offered more than just the mining gear and I don't see you mentioning that at all? Not even a 'well that sounds nice but' kind of statement. You offer absolutely no credit to me at all for at least 'trying to be fair.'

Quote from: Vod on November 19, 2013, 09:26:05 PM

Even if you are, the chances of recovering that purchase amount on mining hardware is very doubtful with today's rising difficulty. It would increase your chances of getting a loan if you were to ask for maybe 50% of the cost of the rig, and pay the other 50% yourself. Then the lender is more likely to get their investment back before they ship the rigs to you.

About the 50%, I would happily pay for half if I could but that is not the case so it is not an option. Although, I did mention something along the lines of what you stated, so I am way ahead of you on that. I already have an arrangement with someone and it is likely that at least 50% of the funds will come from other sources, the issue is that the order must be fulfilled in its entirety and not at 50% so 100% of the funds are required. And I don't necessarily agree with you on profitability, with the recent rise in the value of BTC the hardware is now cheaper (in BTC) and since we are calculating profits in BTC and not fiat money you would be mistaken. If the hardware arrives within the expected time frame then the mining equipment will make a profit in BTC. But this only remains valid if the purchase occurs while the value of BTC-to-dollar remains at its current level or higher.

Quote from: Vod on November 19, 2013, 09:26:05 PM

Finally, it's not realistic to ask for 100% of a rig when the lender could just go out and purchase it himself.

It might not be realistic to expect to receive 100% of the funding to purchase the mining hardware, but there is nothing unrealistic about asking. There are many reasons that a lender may not want to purchase the hardware themselves including but not limited to the fact that some people don't know anything about mining per say and don't feel that they should attempt it themselves and some people are just interested in investing into other ventures and simply don't want to bother with the hardware mess. Yet another group would be that some individuals actually want to promote bitcoin and are willing to do all kinds of things to help others to be involved. There are plenty of others who have different reasons to lend rather than mine so I don't really understand why you would want to limit your perspective solely on those who would want to mine for themselves. People make investments in all kinds of ventures, this one is no different in that respect. And as I stated, I already have support from a group of people who are likely to cover a good portion of the cost.