Quote from: anunymint

Quote from: realr0ach on July 01, 2018, 10:23:15 AM

Quote from: anunymint

The reason that the Satoshi protocol is the one true Bitcoin is because it is the Schelling point (aka emergent consensus of the wealthy) with the most security.

There's far too many completely contradictory claims about bitcoin going on here. You have people like Sidhujag claim shitcoins are better than gold because they can be upgraded, thus making them the completely made up and meaningless word "anti-fragile". My counter claim against him is that, no, that is not a benefit; money does not simply morph into something else at random because then it is non-fungible and there is no Schelling point either.

But it's not possible for shitcoins to be fungible in the first place even if they have built-in tumblers like Monero, simply due to the fact they can and HAVE to be modified constantly. For example, the Theymos push to try and X-out Satoshi coins in old addresses that will eventually become anyone can spend. Or the need to use Lamport signatures or whatever in the future. There are virtually zero Satoshi posts backing up your viewpoint that the protocol as he released is somehow sacred. In fact, it's the exact opposite. He talked constantly about people doing things like altering block size and other variables in the future if/when needed.

You're generally pushing a fringe Popescu claim that just doesn't line up with reality. Bitcoin has always been made up of completely arbitrary, magic numbers with nothing sacred about any of them, and it will never be fungible. This is why physical metals are the Schelling point and not shitcoins, because physical metals are free of political power vacuums, while shitcoins are nothing more than social constructs just like the fiat dollar.

Says the tinfoil atavist who sold his BTC at $600 in August 2016 and rode silver from $20 down to $16, while Bitcoin went to $20k.

Who will listen to someone is 40X poorer than those who didnt follow him.

I never claimed that all the 1000s of shitcoins are better than gold. WTF? Why do you stoop to lying.

Bitcoin does not need to and has not been modified. Various people have fixed various bugs and what not in various software embodiments of the same Satoshi protocol.

Theymos has been fooled many times. But as much as he has tried to destroy the Satoshi protocol, he has not succeeded. Perhaps he has awoken from his stupor. I dunno. Like those of you debating me here, I presume he was just confused by the socialization he received believing in democracy, consensus, etc..

Satoshi employed deception to diffuse dissent. At the link I provided, I went into great detail documenting that he employed deception. I even quoted him. Thus you continue to lie.

The real Bitcoin is not fringe. There is an illusion effect at the moment that allows those people who do not understand Bitcoin to believe that it is fringe. This is done on purpose, so they will lose their Bitcoins and those who correctly understand Bitcoin will remain part of the Republic.

Precious metals are no longer a Schelling point because of the technology that governments have now, metals can no longer be moved without being confiscated. Gold and silver are under the control of nation-states, but Bitcoin has jurisdictional arbitrage and cant be controlled by any partial grouping of nation-states. Also gold cant be moved instantly across great distance in any quantity. And a $billion of gold cant be held in the brain by memorizing 12 words. Also gold and silver arent Ideal Money because as John Nash explained in his Ideal Money treatise they can be manipulated and debased by governments (e.g. the USA bankrupted China by flooding it with silver in the early 1900s), but Bitcoin cant be manipulated by anyone, even though all these scammers such as Core and Bitcoin Cash are trying to attack the real Bitcoin, theyll all fail.

To give you a real world example, I had 18,000 oz (i.e. 1234 lbs!) of that tinfoil shit in 2009, even correctly predicted in 2010 that it would peak at $48 before summer 2011, and much of it was stolen from me because I had to move it out of the U.S.A. (ever heard of imminent divorce?) and being I was in the Philippines I couldnt ship 18,000 oz to Mindanao so I had to store it in Manila and it grew wings and flew away. This was before there were well known bullion repositories in Singapore, which I have considered using recently but every time I think about it, never makes any sense compared to HODLing Bitcoin.

Quote from: realr0ach on July 01, 2018, 02:15:14 PM

Quote from: anunymint

Precious metals are no longer a Schelling point because of the technology that governments have now, metals can no longer be moved without being confiscated. Gold and silver are under the control of nation-states, but Bitcoin has jurisdictional arbitrage and cant be controlled by any partial grouping of nation-states.

Once again you have gotten your facts 100% opposite of what they are in reality. It's ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE more cost effective to create and run a police state in cyberspace than in the physical world.

Apparently you cant read. I will re-quote for you the relevant bit:

Quote from: anunymint

Gold and silver are under the control of nation-states, but Bitcoin has jurisdictional arbitrage and cant be controlled by any partial grouping of nation-states.

. . . . .

Quote from: realr0ach on July 01, 2018, 02:15:14 PM

If the govt attempts to outlaw silver and gold, they do not cease to exist. They still exist and have value.

My friend built a castle in the middle of a huge rice field in the Philippines. He made the mistake of only purchasing 500 sqm plot of land. Now his castle is surrounded by 24 x 7 poverty and karaoke as every peasant decided they wanted to live next to his castle. He cant move the castle, so it is now basically worthless. Gold and silver cant be moved and thus are basically worthless (as Revelation states you will throw them into the street).

Quote from: realr0ach on July 01, 2018, 02:15:14 PM

Since shitcoins have no intrinsic use or value, a govt clampdown destroys them. They're completely worthless.

Again you failed to read. Nothing a partial grouping of nation-states can do to crypto. Youre grasping at strings fool.

Quote from: realr0ach on July 01, 2018, 02:15:14 PM

Only a complete fool would embrace these digital slave systems over sound money - physical silver and gold.

Only a complete fool would listen to a complete fool.

Quote from: realr0ach on July 01, 2018, 02:57:18 PM

First of all, nobody on the right or left gives a damn what govt says anymore. Even back when people respected govt, barely anyone turned in their gold when they tried to confiscate it. So whether the govt attempted to move against shitcoins or metals, they are unable to do either with voluntary compliance. They're required to use force in both cases. The only force they're required to use against shitcoins is knocking on the door of the exchanges or ISPs and filtering out the non-obfuscated traffic. It takes them barely any effort or force to obliterate shitcoins. It takes them a WHOLE LOT of effort to physically attack everyone roaming the planet to confiscate their physical metals.

You seem to completely fail to comprehend how could the wealthy transact their global business by needing to move a $billion of physical gold. Youre thinking about irrelevant little shits like yourself who make no dent whatsoever in the determination of what will be a reserve currency asset. You can sit and shit on your measly stack of metal in your basement until you die, and that is entirely irrelevant.

And it takes no effort for government to regulate the coin dealers. They can shut off your liquidity when ever they want to. You will just have some useless shit sitting in your basement which nobody else will accept in trade because they also cant sell it at a coin dealer because the government shut down the coin dealers.

And your absolutely delusional about the ability of governments to intercept encrypted Internet traffic, or if necessary encrypted HAM radio transmissions. The wealthy can definitely conduct their crypto transactions without the governments interference. Besides they do not even need to do that, because they can simply do jurisdictional hopping to conduct their cryptocurrency transactions from a favorable jurisdiction.

Quote from: realr0ach on July 01, 2018, 03:28:58 PM

Now anonymint is cross-posting in another thread with complete fairy tales claiming shitcoins can't be stopped because if anyone tried to stop them, people can just transmit the blockchain by HAM radio!

Quote from: anunymint

And your absolutely delusional about the ability of governments to intercept encrypted Internet traffic, or if necessary encrypted HAM radio transmissions.

Knowing full well it won't work and is completely unfeasible.

And slimy disingenuous shit you are to quote out-of-context. The wealthy dont need a transaction volume scalable Bitcoin. They need only small blocks for $billion transactions. All you little shits will be kicked off real Bitcoin. Obviously I wrote they will not even need to resort to HAM radios, and my point being that option remains as a fail-safe doomsday scenario backstop for a the very low transaction volume needed by the actual wealthy who matter.