Quote from: McNulty_FR on July 16, 2018, 03:08:04 PM

Quote from: fellestreum on July 16, 2018, 03:05:14 PM

Quote from: McNulty_FR on July 16, 2018, 02:53:01 PM

Quote from: MATTX on July 16, 2018, 01:02:52 PM

Quote from: shanepottermi on July 16, 2018, 12:23:02 PM

The premine remaining unlocked isn't a red herring. When you say its locked and its not thats bad. When you say it'll be locked till x date and you're trying to dip into it prior to that it doesn't look good. Even if its for marketing and not his personal gain. There is absolutely zero excuse for that premine not being locked right now. He needs to start listening to others instead of astroturfing the ANN thread an purging anyone who doesn't just go along to get along. Creating a hand selected community committee is just another form of astroturfing. Its to appease the community an give the illusion that their voices matter when it clearly doesn't. Much like anytime someone brings up complaints in this ANN thread in come brand new accounts praising Dero an Captain trying to drown out any criticism. That isn't an effective long term strat as most people can see right through it.

Dero is not your traditional copy/pasta fork blockchain or big ico without any successful working product. Dero is one of the legitimate product in recent time crypto has seen. Prior to atlantis version blocktime was 2 mins and now its 12 seconds. Blocktime has reduced 10 times. Even if premine was fully locked for 4 years earlier it would open in 48/10= 4.8 months. Those who are following dero deveopment since start will keep loving dero. Earlier It was high lighted by community itself to not lock premine till block-time is finalized..

no Serena is right, it wasn't 2 min in average,but about 3 minutes, it's very easy to verify it

in 7 month (before atlantis release) it should be around 150k blocks, in fact it was less than 100k.

with 2 minutes blocks, it's 720/day: 720*30*7= 151200

What is significance of this? Why did it happen? I dont full understand the Serena allegation that it means coins were hidden mined and siphoned off to an unknown wallet. For this explanation to make sense, there would have to be other evidence. As it stands, it means emission curve is lower, thats all. What is the other evidence concerning this issue? What is Capts statement about it (if any)?

but now the emission is higher than before, not the opposite

So what exactly is the issue here, then? Perhaps that is as intended, to compensate for the lower emission rate before? I have read again, and more carefully and slowly than before, Serena and Mojos Medium article. It is clear to me that they have only presented partial information as to what went wrong in the relationship between them and Capt. After that careful reading, I can say with some confidence that there is no actual evidence of wrongdoing on Capts part. Sure, there is the stuff about possibly using John McAfee, and perhaps using premine on a different schedule than before, and appointing members of DCAB rather than letting the community handle that entirely themselves, and Serena seemed to react (internally) very badly to these things. But there is not even circumstantial evidence that Capt has acted dishonestly, and certainly not the sort of evidence youd need to conclude that Dero is a scam project, not even close. Furthermore, it may be that Capt has his own reasons for not liking the way Serena/Mojo handled moderation, or thought they were doing things out of their remit, or any other number of things. He hasnt commented on those, but we can assume that he has his own side of the story, completely untold here.

The unlocking of the premine, and the combination of anon devs and no source yet released, sure these are issues as have been discussed here a lot already, but these issues were already known before Serena and Mojo let themselves loose. The issues of block times were not raised before, but anyone might have noticed those issues earlier as the data was already there. The single new piece of information to come out of all that was the McAfee connection. And it isnt even certain that this is what Capt was going to do; it was just an idea he was toying with.

I have yet to collate the evidence that Serena and Mojo themselves operated a scam; I still think that is unlikely (though I would like to look at their communications, in combination with Capts, through the pumping and subsequent dumping period, to see if there is any circumstantial evidence). The provisional conclusion I have come to so far is:

- Capt likes to run this project along his own terms and according to his own preferences, and does not run it as a community project in the way that Serena, and possibly Mojo, originally conceived of and perhaps thought they had signed up to when joining the project

- Capt is also willing to change the way things work, adapting to changing conditions, as time goes along; which S/M interpreted as going back on commitments or ideals rather than flexibly changing the way the project was run to adapt to changing circumstances (e.g. the ASIC stuff and McAfee)

- Serena, and to a lesser extent Mojo, went beyond their remit in trying to control the way the project was run, according to their ideals rather than Capts preferences

- Communication between S/M and Capt started to break down as a result of this, and Capt communicated less with them the more important information of the project, and this made the frustrations of S/M worse

- It got to a point where they found the working conditions intolerable and abruptly left, causing all the mayhem we have experienced

I am not passing judgment on the way they handled this or on them as people, I am just trying to come to an objective viewpoint about what happened. I also understand less clearly Mojos role in all of this; it looks like he increasingly came under the spell of Serenas thinking, but it is not clear. As far as it goes though I think the above interpretation fits the facts as we know them.

For us as a community, there are these outstanding issues I think, in no particular order:

1. the locking of premine
2. the changing emission rates
3. the marketing with McAfee and possibly spending part of premine earlier than original stated
4. the main devs anonymity
5. the opening of source to outside audit
6. the forming of a foundation
7. adding Dero to new exchanges

Capt has issued statements on issues 4, 5, and 6. (Personally I dont care if devs remain anonymous if all other issues are adequately dealt with, but thats just me.) If people are not sure to trust his statements, it would be good to go over all past statements on this thread - *his* statements and not Serenas and Mojos - to evaluate the likelihood of his honouring his commitments in these two regards. Note that a significant portion of what people complained about when they complained about the project not meeting goals were based on Serena and Mojos statements as community managers/moderators, and not Capts statements directly. All that needs to be parsed out.

Regarding 1, 2 and 3, I think we should collectively ask him for some sort of statement on these matters. Perhaps this is a matter for the DCAB. Magicsmoker is active here on this thread and is a member of DCAB; perhaps he would like to comment on this? Regarding 1, Capt has made some efforts to show that premine is intact (as of 12 July I think) but this doesnt really go far enough; a more robust method of verifying that premine is intact is needed than a dated screenshot, and also some sort of statement about the future locking of stages of the premine as we originally conceived (even if an official statement to the effect that premine will remain unlocked for whatever reasons).

Regarding 7, I think it is too early to worry about this. We need to wait until other issues are resolved.