Quote from: jbreher on August 01, 2018, 03:24:24 PM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on August 01, 2018, 05:18:35 AM

Quote from: jbreher on August 01, 2018, 04:05:53 AM

Yet another non-sequitur. Tell me a reason you believe that a measure of non-mining validators is in any way a measure of economic majority.

Then what is the correct answer, if you know it? I am not asking as a challenge, but to inquire and learn.

Well, the rather obvious correct answer is that a measure of the number of non-mining validating entities has fuck-all to do with a measure of economic power.

However, your entire argument that the desires of the miners (as a class) is held in check by the desires of non-mining validators (as a class) is utterly dependent upon the assumption that non-mining validator count is a valid proxy for economic power. These numbers bear no relation to each other. Which is why you are either too internally mentally conflicted to be able to see this simple fact, or you are too dishonest in your argument to admit it.

Personally, I don't think Wind_FURY is dishonest,

I believe Wind_FURY is just really really stupid.

* Agree with jbreher*

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non-mining validating entities has fuck-all to do with a measure of economic power.

FYI:
@Wind_FURY, why don't you re read https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4554671.msg42433804#msg42433804
like a few hundred times and see if it sink in , what jbreher told you and Franky1 one already pointed out.

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random guy 'jimmy' with just a node in his basement doesnt have sway over the community direction the network changes. and mining pools also cant just send out a new block format that nodes automatically accept new blocks (blocks do not AI rewrite the rules of nodes)

node users need to download a version that accepts the new blocks. again. pools cant just make a new format and magically make old nodes accept it

now heres where the non-mining community do have sway
what needs to happen is the merchants/exchanges which the pools and users use have more non-mining sway. because if a merchant/exchange is not seeing transactions then pools/users cannot spend their funds. so as i said little jimmy cant sway the network but if the majority of merchants/exchanges accept block B format. usually everyone else follows
...
flipping the argument
anyone can set up 20,000 littl jimmys that accept block B format. and also set up a pool of 56exahash accepting block B.. but in the end if coinbase, blockchain.info, bitstamp, (list many othr merchants) and the pools are still block A, merchants and pools will just reject blockB and ban nodes sending out blockB. thus making block B an altcoin that is unspendabl due to no mrchant adoption

end result is no disruption to the block A network. and block B jimmys and 56exahash pool of block B .. but ends up only communicating with their own kind as a altcoin.

the non-mining nodes DO have sway.. but its not home user sway of majority.. its who will accept my money/sees my payment (merchant) sway

In the end the Merchants hold the economic power as they are the ones accepting or refusing the transactions as payment for their services or products.
Number of non-mining nodes are irrelevant. One is as good as a billion , as long as you can access the one and trust it.
All they do is verify the same entry, so how many times , would you need someone to tell you 2+2=4 over & over again before you believe them.
The Merchants are trusting whichever crypto service node, they are using, so multiple merchants are all trusting Coinbase's non-mining node and caring little about what the other nodes report, such as the one in your basement.