Quote from: Wind_FURY on August 13, 2018, 05:45:41 AM

Quote from: cellard on August 11, 2018, 03:59:01 PM

Quote from: 1Referee on August 11, 2018, 01:54:27 PM

We don't know how effective the futures are on this market. After the peak in 2013 there was a perfectly similar correction dragging the market down for quite a long period of time, especially for crypto standards, and that without futures. We need at least a year or two to see the real effect of these futures markets, and eventually I do believe that they will heavily weigh on Bitcoin's market with how institutions will gain an upper hand.

I think right now it's safe to say that those dealing with futures are just as afraid as most people here are. In other words, futures traders are afraid of Bitcoin manipulation, and Bitcoiners are afraid of futures traders manipulation.

It's all too much of a coincidence to me. I mean the price had to crash eventually, but it turns out it basically started around exactly when CME launched the futures... it could have been exactly the same without the futures launch and $20k was the legit, organic peak for that run, or perhaps it was just getting started and they cut it... who knows? we can never know since there is only one timeline that we can perceive at least.

I have no doubts that the theory weights at least some value. I mean look at the charts, how come these other assets also peaked right when the CME launched their futures? looks like manipulation to me. They keep these assets low while they keep fiat-friendly stocks and bonds up. Our job is to amass as much BTC as possible during this bear market as noobs get kicked out by them, we must be ready because next time it starts rising it will dwarf previous highs and they will not be able to control it anymore. Real money always win in the long term. Bitcoin, gold, silver, all good to go, but biggest massive gains on BTC obviously.

Those charts are scary. Hahaha.

What then would it mean for the miners on the next halving coming on 2020? If "Wall Street cartel" keeps pushing the price down, that would threaten the miners incentives to keep mining. What would happen to Jihan Wu? Will he be pushed out and replaced by the Wall Street cartel's preferred chip maker, making "them" control Bitcoin?

Quote from: fabiorem on August 11, 2018, 03:22:48 PM

About futures, there is this article here: https://blog.goodaudience.com/bitcoin-futures-and-the-ghost-of-gold-81418864c961

The idea is for them to dump the price so that retail traders are out, and then pump it so that they become more rich. But bitcoin moves 5x faster than gold, so we dont need to wait years to see some action. People gain and lose interest on it very quickly.

Bitcoin does have very unique features that these other assets didn't have. It moves much much faster, and the halvening causes bull runs because of the nature of mining. I don't think that they can keep down that momentum very easily, and if they did, they'd lose millions of dollars in the process. Not that it would be a problem, they could just dump the costs on a bank to bankrupt it and have the taxpayers bail it out.

There were a lot of other people waiting anxiously to short Bitcoin when it went past 10k last year. It wasn't just institutional investors; a lot of retail investors thought it was a huge bubble at that time too. The general market sentiment was too high too quickly in Dec.