Quote from: Jungian on January 30, 2014, 01:41:34 PM

Quote from: thaaanos on January 30, 2014, 01:30:38 PM

Quote from: Jungian on January 29, 2014, 03:59:27 PM

Quote from: thaaanos on January 29, 2014, 03:44:48 PM

Quote from: Jungian on January 29, 2014, 11:07:11 AM

Quote from: Xav on January 29, 2014, 10:46:51 AM

"There is enough for everybody’s need, but not enough for anybody’s greed.”

Why would anyone deny what mother nature gave to us; compassion and fairness? One day a scientific analysis will prove that the "Greed is good" doctrine produces nothing more than insatiable hunger, only.

Now we are getting somewhere. You understand that compassion and fairness is inate in our species, yet you don't see the goodness and fairness in behaviour that is denounced as "greedy" (which is just another world for economic self-interrest).
Who denies the compassion and fairness expect those who want a welfare state and control? They DENY that we can have fairness and compassion while being free, while in fact it's the freedom that allows humans to feel this way.

This greed is what created the surplus in the first place. Only when a problem is getting closed to being solved by the freemarket the statist come to talk about the moral implications of it and ask for intervention to feed their own sense of being do-gooders. But in reality the create nothing but poverty, but that is of course mostly what they want. Can't have any more of them evil rich people.

Oh, you mean that insatbile hunger that created the very computer you sit by to type this? The hunger that made sure we had medicine and comfort enugh to live beyond the teenages.

compassion and fairness have been outsourced to the State, for the sole purpose to free the individuals of this moral obligation, and to act greedy not only without guilt but also as a way to soul salvation.
Capitalism would not be/(is?) possible without a Welfare state

It has not been oursourced, as outsourcing requires the act to be volountary. The state is not volountary

On the contrary, capitalism is not possible with the walfare state, as the welfare state can't stand the burden of it's own weight and requires state control of the money to slow the inevitable collaspe. We are not in the last days of the longest experiment of the welfare state ever, with both record debts and inflation aswell as rampant poverty and unemployment.

Financial burdens are nothing like social and moral burdens. You really need a trip down the history lane on how capitalism came to be.

Either adress what I say, or don't, but don't sit there and assume EVERYONE who read the history of capitalism would come to the same conlusion as you. That just makes you look silly.

Welfare state has not always been you know. It came to be by Protestant thinking, tending to the poor was the community's ( the forerunner of the state) obligation for them. So since the community handled all the wrong things, it freed the the individual from such moral burdens. Protestant thinking also assumed that those that were rich were favoured by God, so by exchanging/confusing a couse and effect getting rich is a way to get Gods favour/Salvation. The above combination justified in christian terms the creed that "Greed is Good/Gods Will", and this is how Capitalism came to be.
So Welfare state balances individual Greed so that it can not create moral burdens on a christian soul.

Now if you discard the importance of the moral code christian religion has etched into the western world, and instead accept greed as a prime motive you are just wrong, wrong, wrong.

The above also explains why Catholics, and Orthodox christian population have a problem to "internalize" Capitalism and Individualism, they are incompatible with their dogma. example Russian, Greek, Italian, Spain, Ireland etc. It is no wonder why those countries cannot play this game nor why for example Russia gave rise to Communism.

Back on track another example of welfare state helping Capitalism is Public education.
The idea behind public education came by Capitalists wanting more technically proficient staff, and also a children pen to keep the workforce undistracted by the whereabouts of their children. Yes because people hold the welfare of their children more important than Greed.

Having said all that, I do not exclude deviant speciments in any tradition that depart from moral codes and internalize whatever laws they feel more apt to.

EDIT: Greed as a motivation? guess again: http://www.ted.com/talks/dan_pink_on_motivation.html