Quote from: GreenBits on February 04, 2019, 12:25:06 AM

We agree to disagree then. I cant be more clear about this, and I'm clearly not making this up, it's literally from the government, not even Obama era officials. The things I cite directly are literal definitions and facts from the current White House regarding immigration, I understand if there is a disconnect between reality and what the WH regularly says.

I'm done with this. We aren't making ground, and I believe you think I have more personal interest invested in this than I actually do. To be crystal clear, I am for firmer border policy. I am against the wall. I believe that folks that come here seeking asylum should be afforded due process. And I believe those that come here outside of that very simple process (come to the border, turn yourself in) should be deported immediately without due process. They are invading, it is the prerogative of any State to remove those that would subvert legal process to gain entry. They have shown an inherent non conformance with our rule of law by attempting to enter illegally, which is a terrible start to being among us. I am saying, very clearly, that the majority of folks that come here do so legally. And to do that, they would have to walk up to the border, and enter the country at a point of entry. Which is exactly what the majority of the folks in these caravans have done.

The law is broken, is what we should be talking about. But as I have said, I'm done because for some reason, I have failed to provide you sufficient evidence. I believe that the statistics put out by the current administration support my assertion. Not trying to advance any agenda here; I'm not about to sway opinions here. The majority of voices in this forum are conservative. And this forum is obscure; it's a source of information about bitcoin. Not politics. No one comes here to get their political opinions. And I dont affiliate with liberal policies as much as you seem to think. I'm actually a moderate, I know that seems rare nowadays, but the majority of us are. The world is much more grey that black and white.

Please speak your peace, and lets move on from this. No one really gives a fuck what I think concerning this, and my opinions will not sway policy. I'm simply a talking head, and I grow tired of this mental exercise with you.

This was kinda fun, up until we stopped communicating which each other. I am eager to respond to your post in the abortion thread, I will address it a little later after I catch up on my work. Thank you for your attentions and time in our debate, and have a blessed weekend (what little remains!)

I don't see any disconnect, and you yourself cited the facts that I stated from those same government sources. People can apply for asylum at a port of entry. This is a fact. it is illegal to cross the border without authorization at a designated checkpoint. This is a fact. "The majority come here legally" I already addressed. Not only can you not prove this conclusion, it is irrelevant. It is like saying robbery happens more in this town so lets not enforce against robberies in this town. Also where exactly are stats on undocumented illegal immigration collected if it is undocumented? Any numbers you have are at best an estimate. Now if you are done pretending I am being irrational and unwilling to listen to facts, care to discuss the topic?

I have seen more people than I can count that think of themselves as moderates or centrists, but the fact is The Overton Window has moved SO FAR left that former classic liberals are now described as far right. So you being "moderate" could be anywhere between moderate and Mao Tse Tung. While I doubt you are quite that far left, a lot of the rhetoric and talking points you use are in fact far left talking points and policies.

I give a fuck what you have to say. You could sway me. Unfortunately so far it seems you have been operating from assumption then building facts around that to make a case rather than understanding what you are presenting first and going from that position. If you don't want to butt heads with me, I understand, but if you are bringing contrary facts to the table I will integrate them. Unfortunately any contrary facts you have brought are inconsequential to the premise, even of these side issues you insist on diverging off into. I do feel we are still communicating, I just fear you didn't get the result you were hoping for here. Hopefully we can continue a discussion.

Unfortunately I fear this entire scenario is just an attempt at diverting from and ending any discussion of the double standards held for "liberals" and "conservatives" in the media and among some individuals. Wearing a hat in support of the president excuses harassment and threats of violent actions for the other, but openly racist acts on the left are excused with a whimper, not to mention all the violence and other various crimes often attributed to the right every time ANTIFA shows up and attacks for example.