Quote from: CoinCube on April 30, 2019, 04:22:35 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on April 30, 2019, 02:01:20 AM

Quote from: CoinCube on April 30, 2019, 01:04:00 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on April 29, 2019, 11:45:35 PM

You really don't have control over your thoughts and actions as you think you do.

If the universe is deterministic, you have no control over your actions, they are the result of causations that preceded them.
If the universe is non-deterministic, there must be some randomness inside or outside of your brain over which you have no control.

i.e. there is no free will.

That is why the notion that God created evil but gave homo sapiens 'free will' does not make any logical sense.

We either have free will or we have such a perfect illusion of free will that the difference from our frame of reference is moot.

...

Because you say so? Where is your logic, went out of the window? I gave you a logical conclusion about why there cannot possibly be free will.

Your assertion is baseless.

My assertion is most definitely not baseless. We cannot know higher order perspectives of reality for they are outside of our frame of reference.

From a sufficiently high Godlike perspective time itself may not even exist and everything may appear as a four dimensional structure consisting of the present past and future simultaneously.

See: TIME is an ILLUSION
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VYZQxMowBsw

If that were the case then from that Godly perch not only do we not have free will we dont even have a future. We would be more akin to Gods finished painting a fixed image or work of art.

Say for a moment that is the nature of reality. Would the simultaneous existence of our fixed future change anything? No because it is totally outside of our perceived reality. From our perspective that future is yet to come and will be brought into existence by our actions. For us it may as well not yet exist.

Free will is the same problem. Free will may indeed be an illusion but if it is the illusion is perfect for the determinism is undetectable to those of us living under it. Thus from our limited perspective of we either have free will or we have a perfect illusion of free will. The difference between the two are undetectable for us and thus moot.

In your world, free will might be an illusion based on your grandiose God Delusion (GGD).

In the real world, unknowns remain unknowns until they become knowns. And there is no such thing as God entity 'painting his work of art'.

There is no free will, things are either determined by the physical laws (neurons firing in your brain) or non-deterministic randomness outside of our control. Both cases push the concept of free will into notbatman's la-la-land.