Quote from: CoinCube on May 20, 2019, 09:10:46 AM

Quote from: dippididodaday on May 20, 2019, 07:27:12 AM

Quote from: af_newbie on May 20, 2019, 12:19:14 AM

I think science outpaced our linguistic development.

We humans will never be able to escape our neurophysiologically hardwired, linguistic meaning making mechanisms - it is rooted to the core of our being. But science has indeed prodded religious linguistics as a superficial kind, a kind that needed a rude awakening, a disillusionment if you will. Yes, it is through the applied methodology of science that religious members became disappointed, dissatisfied and utterly discontented with the cheap spells that their various sects have so lavishly kept casting on them to keep the poor parishioners illusioned and falsely enchanted throughout the entirety of their miserable lives.

But you are right, we need new linguistic jargon that will unleash the exploring minds of humans, but keep us grounded in the materialistic reality, through which science has granted us a much fuller, clearer (disenchanted) and sense driven understanding.

Ok one last post before I go because this is so earily similar to something I just read. Uncle Screwtape from the the book by C.S. Lewis would absolutely agree with you here dippididodaddy.

Jargon, not argument, is your best ally in keeping him from the Church. Don't waste time trying to make him think that materialism is true! Make him think it is strong, or stark, or courageous--that it is the philosophy of the future. That's the sort of thing he cares about.
The trouble about argument is that it moves the whole struggle on to the Enemy's own ground. He can argue too; whereas in really practical propaganda of the kind I am suggesting He has been shown for centuries to be greatly the inferior of Our Father Below. By the very act of arguing, you awake the patient's reason; and once it is awake, who can foresee the result?

Even if a particular train of thought can be twisted so as to end in our favor, you will find that you have been strengthening in your patient the fatal habit of attending to universal issues and withdrawing his attention from the stream of immediate sense experiences. Your business is to fix his attention on the stream. Teach him to call it "real life" and don't let him ask what he means by "real." - Uncle Screwtape

The Screwtape Letters by C.S. Lewis
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D3MWVMKKY3A&

That is the root cause of the problem. There is no 'us vs them'. There is just 'us' in this vast universe. A constantly evolving lifeform that is capable of being aware of where it is and what it is.

The sooner you realize that the sooner you'll shed the veils of your delusion.

I guess the best advice I can give you is don't jump to conclusions of "what happened or was before the Big Bang", "was there before the Big Bang" or "what is the Dark Energy or Dark Matter" without fully understanding and having evidence to support your conclusions.

Otherwise, you'll look like a delusional, babbling fool.

As for your constant references to the religious cult you were born into, well, they carry no weight in the real world. As good as any reference to any fictional characters from thousands of other cults humans developed over the years. You are barking at the wrong tree.

I urge you to re-educate yourself in science, it will provide you with a much clearer picture of what is happening to you and others around you. It will become abundantly clear that there are no ghosts, spirits, heaven or hell or any of the supernatural constructs human minds managed to contrive.

And that unknown, undefined entity of yours is not it. If it is undefined and unknown, let it be that. Don't assign any additional properties to something you don't know or understand.

Try MIT OCW https://www.youtube.com/user/MIT/videos

PS.
Since you like what other people say on the subject, I'll leave you with what Paul Dirac once said:

"I cannot understand why we idle discussing religion. If we are honestand scientists have to bewe must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality. The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination. It is quite understandable why primitive people, who were so much more exposed to the overpowering forces of nature than we are today, should have personified these forces in fear and trembling. But nowadays, when we understand so many natural processes, we have no need for such solutions. I can't for the life of me see how the postulate of an Almighty God helps us in any way. What I do see is that this assumption leads to such unproductive questions as why God allows so much misery and injustice, the exploitation of the poor by the rich and all the other horrors He might have prevented. If religion is still being taught, it is by no means because its ideas still convince us, but simply because some of us want to keep the lower classes quiet. Quiet people are much easier to govern than clamorous and dissatisfied ones. They are also much easier to exploit. Religion is a kind of opium that allows a nation to lull itself into wishful dreams and so forget the injustices that are being perpetrated against the people. Hence the close alliance between those two great political forces, the State and the Church. Both need the illusion that a kindly God rewardsin heaven if not on earthall those who have not risen up against injustice, who have done their duty quietly and uncomplainingly. That is precisely why the honest assertion that God is a mere product of the human imagination is branded as the worst of all mortal sins."