Quote from: BADecker on November 18, 2019, 03:57:42 PM

Quote from: styca on November 18, 2019, 05:48:39 AM

Quote from: BADecker on November 17, 2019, 10:48:39 PM

Regarding the existence of God, there is no faith. There is knowledge. The knowledge is based on going beyond 10 to the 40th power regarding some things that are literally impossible without God. It is based on the Machine-Maker of the universe; we have no other evidence of machines coming into existence but by makers.

There is absolutely no knowledge or evidence for God. If you think you have knowledge of something but there is zero evidence for it, then it isn't knowledge, it's faith.
Nothing is proven to be literally impossible without God.
We have huge amounts of evidence of machines, such as humans, coming into existence through evolution, without a maker.

Besides the machine universe having a maker as all machines, there is the proof for God in the fact that when you combine cause-and-effect, entropy and complexity as they are in this universe, there is no other method for the universe to exist other than creation by God.

Throw handfuls of element dust into the air for a hundred years. Nature will never make anything approaching the complexity of life out of any of it. There has to be design, and nature isn't intelligent, so it can't design things. Accidents don't make complexity, or can you show us some accidental complexity and prove it was accidental?

Quote from: styca on November 18, 2019, 05:48:39 AM

Quote from: BADecker on November 17, 2019, 10:48:39 PM

And there is the complexity of what exists... the knowledge that the more complex the machine, the more capable the maker.

Evolution. Complexity can and does evolve over time. Things like eyeballs didn't suddenly spring into existence, they started as slightly light-sensitive skin. Evolution takes huge amounts of time.

That's a nice story that you have there. But you don't have any proof that the so-called various stages of eye development in the animals in nature, weren't created by God to be just this way. But we have lots of evidence that they were created by God to be the way they are, rather than stages in changing development. What is our evidence? Like beget like. Their offspring are the same as their parents regarding eye development, and development in the rest of their bodies.

So far, nobody has proven that changes are anything other than simple change, adaptation, or like-begets-like. This doesn't mean that we can't create something in the lab. But in nature, there is nothing like evolution.

Quote from: styca on November 18, 2019, 05:48:39 AM

Quote from: BADecker on November 17, 2019, 10:48:39 PM

If FSM can be shown to have been able to make the machine universe, then the FSM might be God. The point is that God exists.

Yes, if FSM can be shown to have made the universe I will accept (but not worship) it as God. The point is we have zero evidence.

The FSM has no God-description behind it. It is an idol set up by people, with no methods or evidence for the claims the people make about it.

Whatever God really is, such is shown that God exists through the methods described in my first response, above.

All that anybody has for evolution-theory-evolution is talk... a fun science fiction story. There is evidence for it that fits other things better. And there is no proof at all. Believing in evolution is religious belief.

Evolution is a hoax.

Cool

What is God and how was it created?