Quote from: Johnny Bitcoinseed on February 27, 2014, 03:01:23 PM

Poverty becomes their job, my friends. When it's raining outside and you've partied all night you can choose to

a) go out and earn some money
or
b) sleep in and party again tonight because you know working people are sending you a check

Getting a job doesn't make you rich. This isn't about rich and poor really. Every human being costs x amount of resources and has to be accounted for one way or the other. Basic income allows the human being to develop their skills, educate themselves and live up to their potential while prison, poverty and some of the other options only suppress human potential.

The idea I have is to use a dividend based around shares in DACs. DACs don't become profitable without any work. If you are going to use 3d printers or develop cool new products you have to be very creative. Artists have to design and render the product. Marketing campaigns have to be developed. It's not as simple as just giving people money and expecting value to generate itself, instead tools have to be built to facilitate value creation.

And value isn't created by a useless 9-5 but by innovation and production.

Quote from: Johnny Bitcoinseed on February 27, 2014, 03:01:23 PM

Long term poverty tends to be a choice. We have all seen 3rd generation welfare families. 'Cmon...three generations of people couldn't make the effort to uplift themselves? Really???

It's not entirely a choice if we aren't giving people a better option. If it's impossible to get rich, and easier to go to jail, then people will take welfare. If there is basic income instead of welfare then if people want more than just the minimum then they'll have to create value by making something new or doing something important.

Most jobs people have today are not important, don't make anything new, and will soon be automated. What happens next?

Quote from: Johnny Bitcoinseed on February 27, 2014, 03:01:23 PM

Need money - come to my place and mow my lawn, rake leaves, weed the garden. What? No takers? Oh, the poverty!

Machines will do that, so what happens next? You're not thinking of the big picture are you?

Quote from: Johnny Bitcoinseed on February 27, 2014, 03:01:23 PM

Get a job or make one. It's that simple.

How do you make a job without investors? How do you have investors without people who have enough saved?
Crowd funding allows anyone to become an investor in anyone else. If everyone in the community is a shareholder and anyone can crowd fund anything then there is plenty of money for people who want to start a business to make jobs.

But in order for people to have money to invest they need basic income because you can't invest if you can't eat or pay rent. People who you think should mow your lawn are people I think should be investors and shareholders.

Quote from: Johnny Bitcoinseed on February 27, 2014, 03:01:23 PM

Hell, I know an obese "retarded" guy with a limp named Lenny who makes the rounds every day at the local businesses - he gets them coffee, donuts, lunch etc and they pay him to do it.

Are you saying most "poor" people do not have the skills and energy of a fat, physically impaired retarded guy?

Give me a break. Long term poverty is a choice.

Long term poverty is a choice? So you know the secret to getting rich and if everyone follows those steps then everyone can do it? I don't think the situation is that simple. You ignore technological unemployment and the effects of automation. People just aren't all that useful for labor anymore.

So if the machines will be doing the labor what should the people who don't want to live poor do? They should own shares in the machines which do the labor. Bitcoin shows the way, let the computer mine for you.