Quote from: TravelMug on Today at 06:19:02 AM

Quote from: Bitstradamus on July 07, 2020, 11:38:13 PM

Quote from: TravelMug on July 07, 2020, 11:24:54 PM

Quote from: kingzpro on July 07, 2020, 10:39:21 PM

KIN has been a story full of struggle and ups and down there fight with regulators seem never ending but i am happy to see that they are still here still developing and still growing unlike telegram who gave up their blockchain project ton due to regulator interference they should also have fought and continue the project as far as i know that was also one of the most advanced blockchain network that they were developing so never give up.

You can't compare the two, KIN has been on the cryptosphere for so long before they have been sued by SEC and eventually lost the case and the price literally went to 0.

However, the stigma that KIN had today because of that case can't be forgotten, and for sure lost a lot of investors already. But we appreciate their hard work trying to climb back, so good luck to them. Hope they can get back and prove that they are really a good project that can offer something different in the crypto space.

Agreed. Although there was some similarities as far as why the regulators were looking into both, each also had many differences too.

Just to clarify, KIN hasn't lost the case. It's still ongoing. All of the long processes related to the case like discovery and what not are over and it's at the final step. There is a tele-conference on the 9th with Kik, the SEC, and the judge. Although the judge could make a decision at that moment, it's more likely that he will take a month or so to make a decision. So the case is still active, but very close to the end. The decision can be made by the judge, or he can leave it up to a jury to decide instead.

Thank you for that clarification, I was under the impression that KIN has lost the case as well.

Anyway, we will see how it goes, we all know that SEC is likely throwing everything on its path, suing everyone they deemed violates their law. What do you think will be the implications of KIN loses the case though? Specially that they are trying to really get the pieces back?

I'll first start this answer off by mentioned I'm definitely not a lawyer and this is just my own thoughts.

Another thing to point out is this case is specifically about the Token Distribution Event and not about the current state of KIN. The SEC is claiming that the way that KIN was sold and distributed back in 2017 itself was an unregistered securities event.

As I understand it, the outcome has many different possibilities. Best case the Judge or Jury finds that Kik didn't violate securities laws. If that's the case there would be no penalty and it would likely be safe to assume that KIN itself is not a security today either.

It's possible that the Judge or Jury does find that the sale of KIN was a securities transaction to the public, but not the investors. That would mean that the potential penalty would be smaller compared to being penalized for the entire sale.

It's also possible that the Judge or Jury does find that the sale of KIN was a securities transaction to both the public and the accredited investors. If that's the case the penalty would be larger.

Even if that last scenario happens, it doesn't necessarily mean the end of KIN. Kik Interactive would have to pay fines and whatever else is required, but then might just carry on with their development and plans. I guess it's also possible that an outcome could also require that Kik Interactive no longer participates in the ecosystem or something, but I'm not 100% sure. Even if that was the case, there are 50+ other apps who are developing for the ecosystem. Yes Kik does have a larger role in the ecosystem today, but that role is becoming smaller and smaller each day as the ecosystem grows and becomes more decentralized. So it isn't crazy to think that KIN can continue on even if Kik Interactive is diluted as the outcome of the case.

The most important thing is if KIN is a security today. Unfortunately that's not what the case is about and most likely won't get a ruling on that topic. If it goes to trial it's possible the talking point comes up and someone on the SEC is forced to give their opinion on the status today, but not sure the likelyhood of that coming into play. Unlike Telegram, KIN tokens are already in the wild. Already being used by millions of users every month. Shutting down Kik (one app of the ecosystem, but yes the founding app) might hurt KIN in the short term, but not be the end of the project.

Because of Coronavirus there was teleconference meeting between the SEC, Kik, and the Judge yesterday. These are usually open to the public in person, but was instead open to the public via phone. I called in and listed. It was very informative and interesting. Kik has hired some of the top lawyers around. It has a powerhouse team. I might be bias, but they came off as way more prepared and professional than the two government SEC employee lawyers. The Judge is very old (88 I think) which wasn't ideal, but he still seems sharp and understanding. He plays devils advocate with both sides to really test their arguments. It was all recorded. If you're interested in getting a feel for the arguments and where everything stands today. I would suggest taking a listen here:

https://soundcloud.com/judasaint33/oral-arguments-sec-vs-kik