Quote from: Pamadar on Today at 04:03:43 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 14, 2022, 09:43:43 PM

Quote from: Pamadar on April 14, 2022, 05:45:45 PM

Quote from: sensimilia on April 14, 2022, 02:55:43 PM

Quote from: BitcoinIsABubble on March 14, 2022, 09:51:14 AM

Borrowing money from the bank to invest in crypto is essentially betting on which asset would appreciate more, a currency which suffers from inflation and has unlimited supply or an asset with storing value + utility. So yes, it would be weird not to do it.

If he's talking about some ideas about Bitcoin, then politely, here's the market for a while. He has no idea if they'll repay the loan, but we've mentioned the possibility of Bitcoin, but there's not much tension. After a while, the market will return to normal, but investors will be under a lot of pressure to repay the loan if they have some patience, then their problem will be solved from here.

Best if he has other resources to pay that loan aside from waiting for his investment to grow.

This volatile industry is unknown. I mean, the chance is there either you'll gain profits or if the market does the sideways and
you don't have that knowledge and do the panic, the chance of losing a big portion of your loan money will be burned.
Unless you really have a deeper knowledge and you are willing to take that big risk, you never know what the future will be
the chance is equal to everyone it's on you take whether to deal with it or not.

You have the right idea, Pamadar; however, i just believe that you have not fleshed out the situation very well in terms of the value of being able to use a loan.

Of course, the bet could work out either way, and so that is part of the justification that anyone using a loan to speculate on bitcoin (or front load his investment) is prepared that the BTC price could move in either direction during the time of the loan. There are ways to calculate a present value to the money, which I had done in some of my earlier posts in this thread.

Yeah, it is not guaranteed that the loan will pay off, but it is not merely a random assertion that it might work and it might not, and of course, everyone who is contemplating going through a process to use loan money to possibly increase their BTC stash, and to front load their BTC investment timeline should at least go through the individual calculation that attempts to account for the actual terms of the loan and the various up and down scenarios and then decide if overall it is better to get the loan rather than not getting the loan. It could be a close call, and for sure, folks who have a lot more resources can both negotiate better loan terms, but also they can deal with negative outcomes too, including paying the loan off from sources outside of BTC's price going up (which it might not happen by the time the loan comes due).

Very much enlightened and thanks for that insight, I agree with how you describe people who will take this kind of risk.

Taking loans after working with their own understanding on how the market may favor them and also accepting
the kind of risk in case the market will go sideways, a good preparation to have a backup resource to pay back
the loan amount, it will be crucial for small time investors, but for those who have that good credit, they can play
both Long and short investment plan.

Of course, it could be that some people might end up calculating the probabilities of UP, versus DOWN versus SIDEways wrong, but if the ultimate conclusion is that the odds for UP are pretty high, then it may well make sense to take the debt, even though the price could end up going the other way - but the overall odds still justified taking the bet.

So, each person will have to weigh the probabilities, and how much of a burden they might suffer if they end up getting the bet wrong. So for example, if they take a loan for $10k and that loan has a 2 year duration, so they already know that the loan is going to cost them something like $1k, so they already account for that. At the same time, they calculate the odds of the BTC price going up or the BTC price going down within those two years and they conclude that it is likely to go up more than 10% (in order to pay for the debt), but even if it does not end up going up 10%, they realize that the most that it is going to cost them would be $1k to take that gamble so long that they have their back up funds accounted for. So, a common way that people consider would be the mistaken calculation regarding which way the BTC price might go, yet another way would be if the person failed/refused to calculate the costs, and/or even to end up enduring more costs because they were gambling on the source of the back up funds, too.

We already likely realize that there are some people who take chances on loans and credit who are not really in a position to take such chances, and frequently we will hear about those kinds of incidents, we should try NOT to be that kind of a person who does not adequately calculate based on his/her own situation.. and yeah, even one of the common calculations might regard a future cashflow that might have a 80% to 90% odds of continuing, but on the other hand could end up drying up, too.... and just because there are a variety of calculations or places that the loan could go wrong, there still is likelihood that a person can sufficiently research into his/her own situation to be able to calculate whether or not to use a loan as leverage - and without knowing the potential borrower's situation, the answer is not obviously one way or another.