Quote from: JayJuanGee on Today at 04:36:31 PM

Quote from: FatFork on Today at 03:30:14 PM

Quote from: Snowshow on Today at 01:05:04 PM

And what that has to do with the question I am always asking: how people can benefit from Bitcoin without new buyers or investors?

Quote from: fxsurfer on November 04, 2018, 04:59:54 PM

In other words, one can profit or benefit from bitcoin only by selling it to new investors for their utilizable resources. These resources can then be practically utilized to provide benefit to the owner. And that is exactly how Ponzi schemes work.

Quote from: fxsurfer on January 29, 2019, 11:26:43 AM

People profited or benefited from other people's actual things like dollars, goods or services, not from changed spreadsheet digits. No one can benefit from that. No one can benefit from Bitcoin.

Quote from: antikvark on January 21, 2020, 02:00:31 PM

Bitcoin holder can benefit from bitcoin only if someone voluntarily chooses to buy it.
<cut> And that's the definition of a ponzi-like scheme.

Quote from: antikvark on February 23, 2020, 11:11:43 AM

I will repeat: the whole point of this topic is the question how can you benefit from bitcoins without selling them to someone.

Quote from: Antithesis on June 08, 2021, 04:54:32 PM

Now the question: can you benefit from the quantity next to your address without a new investor voluntarily accepting this quantity?

Quote from: Snowshow on Today at 01:05:04 PM

What are you trying ti achieve with this sophistry?

Snowshow / Antithesis / antikvark / fxsurfer, you've been doing this since 2017. So I would like to ask you the same question: what are you trying to achieve with this sophistry?

Surely, there seems to be some artificialities to the way the question is raised by either the same person or some dumbass talking point coordination center.

A decent lack of thought because we know that bitcoin buyers/accumulators have tended to benefit from being in bitcoin the longer that they have been in - even though in bitcoin's so far price history, there sometimes could be periods of up 3.5 years in which purchased BTC was not in profits.. yet for anyone with any level of sophistication, the data should not show us to get in and out of bitcoin but rather attempt to have a longer term plan and to accumulate bitcoin through the up and down periods, and in the longer run you are likely going to be in profits and if you continue to accumulate BTC, it is quite likely that you are not even going to have to wait 3.5 years to be in profits and to benefit from BTC.

Lot's of nonsense spread by bitcoin naysayers like Snowshow / Antithesis / antikvark / fxsurfer and perhaps some others on their naysaying team of one.. hahahahahaaha

So far in bitcoin's history, Bitcoin's price performance has brought actual tangible benefits that can be measured in the real world for those persons who had cashed out, and the argument would not even be that you have to cash out (beyond keeping your profits "on paper") so long as bitcoin at least maintains its value/price and perhaps continues to at least gravitate in the upwards direction with price in the coming years (even if there might continue to be some further downs along the way too).

One of the worst kinds of losing scenarios in bitcoin would be if the BTC price continues to gravitate downward in price and never recovers from that downward gravitation, and another kind of losing scenario would be some kind of sudden drop in price to bring bitcoin prices either down to zero or to real low values that causes great impacts on the confidence of BTC HODLers/accumulators.

In my glancing through this thread, I can see presumptions that bitcoin is either not sufficiently holding value or that bitcoin has value on paper only - but those kinds of presumptions are contrary to the actual facts (rather than the fantasy facts presented by bitcoin naysayers like Snowshow / Antithesis / antikvark / fxsurfer).

I am surely a subscriber to the theory that any myth has some real facts attached to it, so in that regard, there would need to be some weighing of which kinds of facts are more material and relevant than others, and for sure with bitcoin price is not the ONLY way to attempt to measure the extent to which some things in the material world actually back it... which we should be able to see and appreciate with the passage of time that bitcoin's network effects continue build.. There are a lot of ways that we could individually measure bitcoin's network effects to attempt to figure out if progress continues to be made.**

**Trace Mayer had been outlining bitcoin's seven network effects going back for several years

I am not going to go into any kind of detailed discussion of how each of the network effects are growing, and surely Snowshow / Antithesis / antikvark / fxsurfer have their rights to express their own fantasylandia opinions and conclusions to the extent that they do not end up getting banned for their disingenuineness ongoing misrepresentations.

You got it all wrong. I don't have presumptions that bitcoin is either not sufficiently holding value or that bitcoin has value on paper only.

All I am doing here is describing the fact that bitcoin doesn't exist, that is, that bitcoin is just a name, while the bitcoin system is a scam system.

You can prove prove this by asking people that invested in the bitcoin system if they are able to benefit from within the system. In all investment systems that are legit, the investors are able to benefit from within these systems in which they invested in. On the other hand, in all investment systems that are scam, people are not able to benefit in that way. That's obviously because there's no value, no economic resources in such systems.

As you can see, I am stating simple facts. You can preach all day long about bitcoin's value, but the very fact that not a single holder in the bitcoin system is able to benefit from within this system is an indisputable empirical proof that your preaching is without basis in reality.