Quote from: P4man on November 02, 2011, 07:19:10 PM

Well, I never said no one in the US got good healthcare or free/subsidized/insured healthcare. I guess much depends what state you live in, but the fact remains you have over 50 million people with no insurance and over 25 million with inadequate insurance. Thats 42% of your population under 65. Forty two %!

It is really an interesting statistic depending on how you spin it. That means 50 million people tend to get healthcare without paying anything. Sometimes it comes from government run health facilities. Often times they get care and just decide not to pay the bills. We have no debtor's prisons for such things. (Nor am I suggesting that we should)

So if you are suggesting that more people in the use should be responsible for paying for their healthcare costs, I couldn't agree more. It would bring the overhead down substantially for those now paying the bills. However, nothing proposed so far aims to make this imbalance better. That is the really sad thing.

Quote from: P4man on November 02, 2011, 07:19:10 PM

The other facts are just as glaring. Child mortality is among the highest of industrialized countries, life expectancy among the lowest. Cost is at least twice that of other countries. Or to quote this study:

"U.S. scores dead last again in healthcare study".

Out of 191 countries on the planet. "The United States ranked last when compared to six other countries -- Britain, Canada, Germany, Netherlands, Australia and New Zealand, the Commonwealth Fund report found."

Come on New Zealand had 4 million people. The Netherlands has 16 million. California and the US are pushing those respective numbers in illegal immigrants alone.

But the study is clear about one thing, we are fat and nobody likes to go to the doctor. We are fat because we are very efficient and productive in feeding ourselves. Even our poor are fat. Our food tends to be good, cheep, and restaurant service is fast. Even Europeans get fat when they come here. Should we take better care of ourselves? Yes we should.

Quote from: P4man on November 02, 2011, 07:19:10 PM

Look, Im all for free markets and market competition, but for some things it just doesnt work, and it shouldnt surprise health insurance is one those things. Keeping people alive just isnt economical and the incentives are perverse and constantly conflict with morality.

I'm pretty much all over these forums saying health insurance is the cause of our problems not the solution. Employer based health insurance is the stupidest concept of them all. I'm quite convinced that nobody should have health insurance. I am however in favor of people receiving proper health CARE. (Feel free to review my other posts on this subject)