Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
⭐ Merited by Hueristic (1)
By the way, cAPSLOCK: When Richy_T civilly disagreed with me based on his outdated information about Blockstream Satellite, and I corrected him, he kinda-sorta acknowledged his mistake; and he continued with a constructive discussion. Why do you dodge the factual correction of your very rude misinformation? 
Your are ill-informed. The trusted setup is dead. Gone with Halo2. Zcash’s Orchard shielded value pool, activated on mainnet in May 2022, has no trusted setup!
That is one of several major reasons why I declare the technology now “mature”: No more trusted setup. I put up with the trusted setup in Zcash myself, from its beginning until 2022; but I disliked it. I would not want to bring it to Bitcoin. The Zcash team also disliked it—actually, they hated it! Therefore, they spent years working on improved cryptography to get rid of it forever.
You also have not answered my point about a “dev tax”. cAPSLOCK, you hate the idea of a “dev tax”; and you insult altcoins that have a “dev tax”. So, over all these years that you have enjoyed Bitcoin, have you donated any nontrivial amounts to support Bitcoin Core development? Developers need to be paid somehow. I know that some big BTC HODLers are very good about this; they tend not to be the ones who sneer at little altcoins for having a “dev tax”, for they understand that developers need to be paid somehow.
ZCASH is a fucking trusted setup
Your are ill-informed. The trusted setup is dead. Gone with Halo2. Zcash’s Orchard shielded value pool, activated on mainnet in May 2022, has no trusted setup!
That is one of several major reasons why I declare the technology now “mature”: No more trusted setup. I put up with the trusted setup in Zcash myself, from its beginning until 2022; but I disliked it. I would not want to bring it to Bitcoin. The Zcash team also disliked it—actually, they hated it! Therefore, they spent years working on improved cryptography to get rid of it forever.
You also have not answered my point about a “dev tax”. cAPSLOCK, you hate the idea of a “dev tax”; and you insult altcoins that have a “dev tax”. So, over all these years that you have enjoyed Bitcoin, have you donated any nontrivial amounts to support Bitcoin Core development? Developers need to be paid somehow. I know that some big BTC HODLers are very good about this; they tend not to be the ones who sneer at little altcoins for having a “dev tax”, for they understand that developers need to be paid somehow.
There are many reasons Zcrap is not discussed here, not the least of which is respect for the WO.
If you want to shill it them start a thread in the appropriate section.
Who knows maybe you will make a convert or two if you do it appropriately.
I haven't even bothered to read your arguments about it as it is about as OFF TOPIC as it gets in the thread and is a complete SCAM in my view.
If you had bothered to read my arguments about it, then you would know that I was not shilling for Zcash. Rather, I am discussing my desire to bring zero-knowledge proof privacy to Bitcoin—a goal which would make Zcash obsolete, thus not a great way to shill for them!
The technology was originally conceived for Bitcoin. Satoshi wished for zero-knowledge proofs. The Zerocoin project was a concept for Bitcoin. The original Zerocash paper presented a design for Bitcoin, before it was eventually turned into the Zcash altcoin. I have linked and/or quoted relevant history here, in the posts that you did not bother to read.
As things now stand, it is practically impossible to discuss zero-knowledge proofs for Bitcoin without discussing the technologies and the real-world experiences from the premier ZK proof privacy altcoin. I will not self-censor to avoid knee-jerk reactions: That would prevent me from discussing my longtime dream of having ZK proof privacy in Bitcoin. I have been wanting that since around 2013, according to my recollection of when I first heard of Zerocoin.
Edit: Extra highlighting added in internal quote. I was talking about Bitcoin.
My impression might not be exactly the same as Hueristic, but still in the ballpark of what the fuck you bringing that shit here.
This is not a technical thread, but you want to bombard the thread with technical mumbo-jumbo, and if you want to fix (improve) bitcoin in various ways work on your BIP and/or partner up with some like-minded and complementary dweeb like ur lil selfie, and set forth the BIP..
If there is a BIP, you can still reference it here.
Surely, in the end, you have the right to post whatever the fuck you want here, including no need to self-sensor like you said, but it seems like you are striving to appeal to the wrong audience in these parts.. we are better at fart jokes and things like that... looking at you @sirazimuth
As things now stand, it is practically impossible to discuss zero-knowledge proofs for Bitcoin without discussing the technologies and the real-world experiences from the premier ZK proof privacy altcoin. I will not self-censor to avoid knee-jerk reactions: That would prevent me from discussing my longtime dream of having ZK proof privacy in Bitcoin. I have been wanting that since around 2013, according to my recollection of when I first heard of Zerocoin.
Just equating Zero Knowledge Proofs to zcrap here is a disingenuous argument, in your continual context you act as though Zcrap led the way when in fact ZKP has been used forever and it is essential to any privacy algorithm.
With that being said there is ZERO reason to bring up that shitcoin when trying to discuss ZKP.
Pretending that Zcash doesn’t have the best and only yet-seen practical way to apply ZKP here is a disingenuous argument. Especially since I want to copy their open-source technology—research and development of which was paid for by their “dev tax”. (Thanks.)
Fuck shitcoins and their pumpenings in these here parts.
There does not exist any other decentralized privacy solution that reveals zero information. In one of the posts that you said you did not bother to read, I explained why.
All other existing privacy solutions either are copies of Zcash, or are centralized (with blind signatures, as Digicash), or rely on decoy obfuscation of leaked information to try to cover up the trail of transactions (Monero mixins). (Or are ridiculous outright scams, such DASH. Or rely on trusted hardware enclaves, like some new shitcoins—literally “Intel inside!”) Monero (or Blockstream’s Liquid) technically use “zero-knowledge proofs” to keep transaction amounts confidential, but they are not overall “zero-knowledge”. Your claim that “ZKP has been used forever and it is essential to any privacy algorithm” is hypertechnical hairsplitting to avoid an obvious point.
All other existing privacy solutions either are copies of Zcash, or are centralized (with blind signatures, as Digicash), or rely on decoy obfuscation of leaked information to try to cover up the trail of transactions (Monero mixins). (Or are ridiculous outright scams, such DASH. Or rely on trusted hardware enclaves, like some new shitcoins—literally “Intel inside!”) Monero (or Blockstream’s Liquid) technically use “zero-knowledge proofs” to keep transaction amounts confidential, but they are not overall “zero-knowledge”. Your claim that “ZKP has been used forever and it is essential to any privacy algorithm” is hypertechnical hairsplitting to avoid an obvious point.
Even if you are correct... who fucking cares?
Do you have a fart joke? or a cladily dressed chica? chico for bbbbbbaaaawwwbbbb.. ?
in udder wurds..
ain't nobody got time for comparison contrasts regarding which shitcoin might be less shitty in terms of some abstract presentations that ONLY fewer than 1 (if that's possible) out of 100 of us will likely understand 1/4 of what you be saying anyhow. Not that very many of us (royal perhaps?) even understand 1/2 of what you be saying when you are talking about somewhat "normal" and potentially within our grasps topics.