Quote from: franky1 on November 25, 2022, 02:03:57 AM

Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on November 08, 2022, 05:05:26 PM

Quote from: franky1 on November 08, 2022, 02:19:29 PM

liquid

Flawed analogy. Lightning isn't a federated sidechain. While operating decentrally, Liquid isn't permissionless in the same way Lightning is. Summarily, Liquid acts as a financial instrument between large Bitcoin companies, which are integral to its operation. It is trust requiring, but it minimizes it, because it divides governance to several trustworthy entities.

Lightning, on the other hand, requires no faith. You need to trust nobody but yourself to transact. Not your partners, not your partners' partners, no one.

please observe

i was discussing the pegging.. and you went full avoidance by talking about other features..

when you start to realise that when people are told to download some free phone app for lightning and see 0 balance and they use an exchange to deposit bitcoin and the exchange then routes them inbound msat.. they think they are getting 1:1000 rated msat..
little do they know how easy it is in just 1 line of code to have the onion payment conversion to commitment actually be a 1:200 rate. and they only learn the hard way when they try to settle the channel..

do you get it yet. lightning does not have a network wide consensus to actually audit payments and value to make sure what someone holds is actually what is owed to them

oh and lightning is federated. but lacks the blockchain bit too
you are federated with a channel partner. and separately someone else is federated to your partner. and they are federated with someone else

you can only make a payment if all federations along the route are online and will agree to authorise payment through them.

LN is permissioned because it needs someone elses permission(co partners signature. route onions approval to forward onion payment and send back acceptance with key
as for trust

well you either hand keys to a watch tower so you can sleep. or stay awake watching your partner doesnt broadcast a old state.. oh wait if you want to sleep without a watch tower.. you need to trust your partner

take the utopia away and try for one month to do some critical thinking. imaging you have value in lightning and you really want to scrutinise it for bugs and flaws. instead of be hopeful and dreamy about it.
start finding the flaws. the ways that a counter party can dupe you out of your value.

then you might learn something

Oh Franky. You had so much time to learn about Lightning, but you obviously still have no idea how it actually works. You pretty much sound like CSW, when he explains Bitcoin.